Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Craig Ewert


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was merge to Right to Die?. The consensus is split between merge and keep, with merge having a slight edge. These are both flavors of keep, so it becomes an editing issue. Fabrictramp |  talk to me  01:42, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Craig Ewert

 * ( [ delete] ) – (View AfD) (View log)

No need for two articles: one on the documentary Right to Die? and one on the biography of this guy which says little more. Xasodfuih (talk) 16:33, 11 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep: I would say keep this and merge the Right to Die? information. On the other hand does the documentary meet Notability (films)? If it does than that should be kept as is. It is somewhat of a catch 22 because Craig Ewert meets the criteria of Notability (people) because of being the subject of this film as well as the coverage of their death overall but does the film, as I said, meet any of the five "General principles" in the guidelines? Either way though - as for this article, keep. Soundvisions1 (talk) 19:55, 11 December 2008 (UTC)
 * About the film: A topic is presumed to be notable if it has received significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject. There are over a thousand articles about the documentary by now . The guy is notable only because he's the subject of the film. Xasodfuih (talk) 20:08, 11 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment: That is the same basic language used in most all guidelines. The subject of this nom meets the same criteria, the one found in Wikipedia:Notability (people) - "A person is presumed to be notable if he or she has been the subject of published secondary source material which is reliable, intellectually independent, and independent of the subject." If there are over a thousand articles on a film about Craig Ewert that also means there are over a thousand articles on Craig Ewert as well. It is not unusual for more than one article related to a subject to exist - Man on the Moon (film) is a film about the life of Andy Kaufman. We also have Harvey Milk as well as an article on the book The Mayor of Castro Street and the documentary The Times of Harvey Milk as well as Judy Garland and the related articles on the biography Me and My Shadows: A Family Memoir and the film Life with Judy Garland: Me and My Shadows. Soundvisions1 (talk) 15:16, 12 December 2008 (UTC)
 * I think DMacks below intended to link to WP:BLP1E, which seems to apply here: he is only notable because of the movie. If you can find sources for his biography other than the movie about his suicide, then you can write a full biography, otherwise you're just duplicating material. Xasodfuih (talk) 15:21, 12 December 2008 (UTC)


 * Merge. Two short and inter-related articles could certainly be put together to make one. Seems to me the documentary is the more notable, as it and its broadcast is what is generating controvesy and media attention. Conversely, WLP1E--the person appears to be just of who-knows-how-many assisted-suicides that happened to be taped. Nom, you don't need to AfD if you just want to merge...that's a simple editorial concern that doesn't necessarily need formal discussion and approval. DMacks (talk) 23:11, 11 December 2008 (UTC)
 * ...and redirect person→film. Not sure I was clear. DMacks (talk) 00:48, 12 December 2008 (UTC)
 * BLP doesn't apply it stands for Biography of Living people and since Ewert is known for his own suicide, he's clearly not living. - Mgm|(talk) 09:07, 12 December 2008 (UTC)
 * But BIO1E applies to dead people as well. I don't quite see why you guys have two rules that say the same thing anyway. Xasodfuih (talk) 15:44, 12 December 2008 (UTC)


 * Keep No need for two articles, but the authoritative one should be the individual. Merge Right to Die? into Craig Ewert and then redirect Right to Die? to Craig Ewert Dman727 (talk) 00:44, 12 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Merge. This clearly warrants more discussion. I'd rather support Craig Ewert being merged into the article on the documentary because he's known for only the one thing. The controversy means the documentary is the more notable of the two. - Mgm|(talk) 09:07, 12 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Merge. I agree with Mgm, the documentary is the more notable of the two so merge Craig Ewert with that. Then expand the Right to Die? article incorporating the Craig Ewert info there. TheRetroGuy (talk) 13:06, 12 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep This article is properly sourced and regards a figure made famous (or infamous) as the turning point of a controversial matter. He is exceedingly notable as the individual who chose to publicize his death in order to allow others to see the reality of assisted suicide. The film, as the vehicle for this publicity, is also famous. If there is any merging, it should be the film article into this article -- not the other way around. If a movie star makes only one hit film and then never appears again, and he is made famous by this movie, do we merge his article into that of the movie? Certainly not. And this is not a forum for discussion on merging. The only valid discussion is here deletion or maintainance -- a discussion on the soundness of merging should be held on the talk pages -- I enter a motion for speedy keep. DRosenbach  ( Talk 18:03, 14 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Merge Complete
 * If the only options are "delete person-article or not", I'd have to go Delete, as the person is not notable. However, the film is indeed notable, so "merge (now done) and redirect there" is the proposed alternative, which is a pretty common AfD result when there's some notable issue or viable content, but not enough for the topic of the page itself. He's not even the first person to commit suicide (assisted or not) in mass media--Kevorkian had a video of it in the 1990s, he's just the one who happened to do it in this case, and all the controvery seems to be about the video and its broadcast and the ideas, not anything tied to this particular individual. DMacks (talk) 19:23, 14 December 2008 (UTC)


 * Keep as either Right to Die? or Death of Craig Ewert, since it's that one event that made him famous. I'd rather it be on the documentary. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 19:19, 14 December 2008 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

This is an invalid conclusion -- keep, delete or no consensus are the only valid conclusions.  DRosenbach  ( Talk 03:58, 16 December 2008 (UTC)