Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/DJ Lotu5 (2nd nomination)


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   keep. ( X! ·  talk )  · @748  · 16:57, 17 January 2010 (UTC)

DJ Lotu5
AfDs for this article: 
 * – ( View AfD View log  •  )

Prior AFD indicated there was a lack of sources and the AFD had low participation, so I am restoring and re-nominating as non-notable for lack of reliable sources notability to gain better consensus.  MBisanz  talk 04:45, 2 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Delete as this personality is not notable. There is a lack of 3rd party references, despite claims that he/she has undertaken various programs, such as aiding potential illegal immigrants. If these were really significant undertakings I would expect to see some 3rd party news coverage at least, but alas, my searches have found nothing. 58.170.83.117 (talk) 05:39, 2 January 2010 (UTC)

There are a lack of 3rd party references? A current google news search:

http://news.google.com/news/search?aq=f&pz=1&cf=all&ned=us&hl=en&q=micha+cardenas

shows 490 news article about the art project the Transborder Immigrant Tool.

There is also a current article in Art21, a PBS series about 21st century artists, which since the article is about an artist, seems like a very reputable 3rd party reference:

http://blog.art21.org/2009/12/31/performative-interventions-the-progression-of-4d-art-in-a-virtual-3d-world/

Perhaps the Los Angeles Times is a reliable 3rd party source?

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/culturemonster/2009/05/freephone-project.html

Or an educational site, the Center for Research in Computing and the Arts at UCSD.edu?

http://crca.ucsd.edu/

Lotu5 (talk) 06:36, 2 January 2010 (UTC)

As for your he/she comment, I would hope that Wikipedia editors could at very least follow the AP stylebook guidelines for journalism stating that:

Use the pronoun preferred by the individuals who have acquired the physical characteristics (by hormone therapy, body modification, or surgery) of the opposite sex and present themselves in a way that does not correspond with their sex at birth. If that preference is not expressed, use the pronoun consistent with the way the individuals live publicly.

Since the article is about a person who has received hormone therapy and presents as a woman, there is no acceptable reason to say he/she, aside from being a sexist slur. Lotu5 (talk) 06:43, 2 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Wikipedia editors generally follow Wikipedia's guideline's, as opposed to those put forward by other entities, and acceptability is determined by a consensus of the contributors. We also ask that you assume good faith; my previous unsigned comment used the he/she construct to avoid insult, not to cause it. I reached my conclusions based on searches using the article's name, which returned no third party references. As you've demonstrated, when searching using the name Micha Cárdenas, there is some third party coverage. As a result, I have withdrawn my previous unsigned comment. No hard feelings? Handschuh-talk to me 13:35, 2 January 2010 (UTC)

*Delete and recreate article as Micha Cárdenas. Subject's involvement with Transborder Immigration Tool software is probably notable, though subject is generally only pictured and acknowledged in news articles I've read. Other links provided show some hints of notability, though there is nothing to indicate that this pseudonym of the person is notable. Even the PBS (blog) link provided uses a different name for this person as an artist. The only consistently verifiable name for subject is Micha Cárdenas. I suggest deletion and recreation as the article being considered has a significant WP:COI feel to it. Vulture19 (talk) 12:48, 2 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Keep per evidence presented by Lotu5 and further independent sources covering his/her work at the Mexican border (NBC Chicago, East Valley Tribune (originally AP)) and his/her artistic activities (The Daily Aztec, PhysOrg.com). It is possible to expand/fix the current (COI?) version using reliable third party sources. In my opinion, the artist and activist Micha Cardenas meets general notability guideline. --Vejvančický (talk) 08:34, 2 January 2010 (UTC)
 * I agree with renaming to Micha Cárdenas. --Vejvančický (talk) 12:55, 2 January 2010 (UTC)
 * How's about we split the difference and just move the article without deleting and recreating it? Handschuh-talk to me 13:25, 2 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Done. --Vejvančický (talk) 13:36, 2 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Keep newly renamed article. The article will require a massive rewrite to accurately reflect subject's notability, however. If it appears the article will be kept, and no one else is motivated to do so, I will probably attempt this myself. Vulture19 (talk) 15:50, 2 January 2010 (UTC)

 Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, JForget  02:33, 10 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so consensus may be reached.
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.