Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Dalit History Month


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was no consensus. Opinions are divided about whether there are enough good sources for this topic, and this isn't something I can decide as the closer.  Sandstein  06:34, 18 January 2020 (UTC)

Dalit History Month

 * – ( View AfD View log  Stats )

Fails WP:EVENT and WP:GNG.

Coverage is trivial and made by partisan sources for promoting an agenda. Nothing significant or notable has been proven. Unreliable blog sources at best only talk about "why we need Dalit History month", which means that there is no such month and Wikipedia should not be used for advocacy per WP:ADVOCACY and WP:PROMOTION. WalkingDisks (talk) 15:12, 3 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of India-related deletion discussions. WalkingDisks (talk) 15:21, 3 January 2020 (UTC)


 * Keep Passes WP:GNG e.g. 1, 2, 3.Pontificalibus 17:15, 3 January 2020 (UTC)
 * These sources are unreliable and they frequently publish the articles they have received from their readers. The News Minute makes it clear on the source that "It is for these reasons that, through the month of April, The News Minute brings its readers a series of special reports and articles focused on caste, with the objective of keeping the conversation going." It fails WP:RS. Shouldn't be hard to identify that these sources reads like typical press-releases.  Bharatiya  29  19:16, 3 January 2020 (UTC)


 * Delete Apparently this "history month" is going on for 5 years but lacks any significant coverage from independent reliable sources such as WP:HISTRS and WP:SCHOLARSHIP sources. Bharatiya  29  19:16, 3 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Keep passes WP:GNG and WP:LASTING.There is significant coverage in reliable  sources, clearly independent leading Indian newspapers ,magazines ,newsites including Deccan Herald ,First Post ,Business Standard,LiveMint,The Indian Express ,The Hindu ,Huffington Post ,ThePrint  ,The Asian Age ,The Week ,Outlook and Hindustan Times amongst others and also Academic journals like Television & New Media published by SAGE Publications and CrossCurrents this is without going through the Indian regional language media.Please note we are not comparing the sources of this article with Black History Month.Some newspapers are publishing a series of articles as part of Dalit history Month and there some other references in the article.As noted in the Washington Post ref below a news portal called The News Minute  became the first mainstream English media outlet in India to run a Dalit History Month series on caste discrimination, Dalit poetry and art and this being followed by some other newspapers as well of publishing a series of articles not just one single article under Dalit history Month.
 * Please note the references below are from leading mainstream Indian newspapers and magazines  and I strongly disagree that all of them are  promoting an agenda and publishing press releases or advertising in the form of articles to promote this, the only major Indian English newspaper not below is The Times of India.Most of them have been considered reliable  sources for years  and see no major issue in the RSN board to be considered otherwise  or to be considered partisan.
 * The Asian Age How Wikipedia cancels dalit icons
 * The Hindu Celebrating Dalit History Month
 * Huffington Post Dalit History Month Is A Love Letter To Our Ancestors
 * Deccan Herald A month to reminisce Dalit contribution to history
 * First Post   Ambedkar Jayanti 2017: Here's a look at Dalit History Month to explore forgotten narratives
 * Feminism India  Writing Our Own Histories – Why We Need Dalit History Month
 * LiveMint A brief history of the Dalit memoir
 * Spotted Goddesses: Dalit Women's Agency-Narratives on Caste and Gender Violence
 * Washington Post The new 140-character war on India’s caste system
 * Business Standard Revisiting stories to revive Dalit history Dalit History Month hopes to refocus the world's attention on the experiences of the community
 * Hindustan Times Why we must not do away with reservations for Dalits: Opinion by Sadhguru
 * ThePrint of Shekhar Gupta DALIT HISTORY MONTH Articles that are part of the Dalit History Month series
 * First Post Dalit history month: In UP's Chitrakoot upper-caste sanitation workers outsource cleaning to lower-castes, paying them paltry sums as wages
 * The News Minute The Dalit History Month Series.
 * The Wire Dalit History Month: Education Is a Distant Dream for Some Children
 * Himal Southasian Dalit History Month
 * India Abroad A call for Dalit Renaissance: Oppressed community confronts diaspora’s discrimination
 * Asia News Indian bishops invite the faithful to celebrate April as ‘Dalit history month'
 * Daily hunt  A  month to reminisce Dalit contribution to history
 * The Indian Express How Babasaheb helped me understand my identity as a Dalit-Christian
 * Scroll Resistance and resilience: Dalit History Month 2018 showcases neglected histories and untold stories
 * Deccan Herald Ambedkar Jayanti: A year of turbulence and some hope
 * The Week Unapologetically yours
 * Outlook These Arrows Don’t Miss Their Mark
 * ThePrint Dalit history threatens the powerful. That is why they want to erase, destroy and jail it
 * Scroll Resistance and resilience: Dalit History Month 2018 showcases neglected histories and untold stories
 * Television & New Media published by SAGE Publications New Media and the Dalit Counter-public Sphere Sage Journals
 * CrossCurrents "Resisting Injustice: Seeking New Ways to Speak!" Cross Currents
 * Pharaoh of the Wizards (talk) 00:51, 4 January 2020 (UTC)




 * Consider comparing these passing mentions, inferior, unreliable, and plain advertisements with the sources concerning Black History Month, a history month which this subject (Dalit history month) is admittedly attempting to imitate. You would realize that this subject has failed to attract "significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject". WalkingDisks (talk) 07:43, 5 January 2020 (UTC)
 * I updated my table following this comment. I would repeat it again, that this is subject promotes historical revisionism and we need neutral reliable (preferably scholarly sources) to define this subject. The sources we have right now are far from that. WalkingDisks (talk) 11:55, 6 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of History-related deletion discussions. North America1000 13:11, 4 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Events-related deletion discussions. North America1000 13:11, 4 January 2020 (UTC)


 * Keep per sources brought by Pharaoh of the Wizards and visible in my own search.NotButtigieg (talk) 16:10, 4 January 2020 (UTC)
 * I have analyzed them right above. Can you show your sources too? WalkingDisks (talk) 07:44, 5 January 2020 (UTC)
 * courtesy ping to . —usernamekiran(talk) 22:58, 5 January 2020 (UTC)
 * I would say that the Deccan Herald article A month to reminisce Dalit contribution to history is focused on this month, and in in depth.  And although it is only an opiniion essay, editors may see the relevance of the discussion of Dalit History Month in How Wikipedia cancels dalit icons .  My searchs bring up quite a lot of sources, including "transmedia artist and activist Thenmozhi Soundarajan along with other Dalit women in the US and in India helped lead the #DalitWomenFight campaign and started Dalit History Month in April to exemplify Dalit history and resistance." (p. 60, Spotted goddesses : Dalit women's agency-narratives on caste and gender violence, Roja Singh, Zürich : Lit Verlag GmbH & Co. KG Wien, [2018]). NotButtigieg (talk) 15:47, 6 January 2020 (UTC)
 * The first example is obviously a non-neutral press release (as highlighted by the nominator). The second example is a mere passing mention. How do these sources fulfil the GNG requirements? --RaviC (talk) 01:03, 11 January 2020 (UTC)
 * V Ajmal is a Journalist writing in the Deccan Herald and writes on numerous topics clearly diverse topics as ‘Sumac’ offers authentic Turkish, Afghan dishes to Weight Loss to Kerala Election Victory as seen here and Deccan Herald is WP:RS and this is  not a Press release or an interview  A month to reminisce Dalit contribution to history.Please go through all the articles written by him here they are all indepedent disagree with the nom's assessment.Pharaoh of the Wizards (talk) 03:26, 11 January 2020 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Keep per sources found above. Bearian (talk) 20:12, 7 January 2020 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks,  Sandstein   15:42, 10 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Comment -- If this is notable as the author of the table seems to imply, it requires a much more substantial article that says what the "month" has achieved.  I am not disputing the reliability of the article, but am questioning whether it is notable.  Peterkingiron (talk) 16:17, 10 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete. I like this and think it is awesome, but the sum of all the parts of this come across as slightly promotional and possibly the case that this is perhaps a bit too new - which sort of feeds back into the promotional vibe I'm getting from this.  Yes, I am aware that this has its roots from 2013 as an observance.  I would rather see this return to Wikipedia after it has some solid footing on its own. -- Dennis The Tiger   (Rawr and stuff) 21:26, 10 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete per nom and Bharatiya29. Similar press-releases, hashtag promotions and articles mainly involving interviews of closely involved people fails our requirement of significant coverage from independent sources. --RaviC (talk) 01:15, 11 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Keep per sources found above. We need more authentic WP:RS verification rather than deletion nominator himself(WalkingDisks).Shankar2001 (talk) 02:04, 11 January 2020 (UTC)
 * And which 'sources' are you talking about? You need to focus on content not editor. WalkingDisks (talk) 09:38, 11 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Further reading: WP:MUSTBESOURCES, and But there must be sources!. —usernamekiran(talk) 19:23, 17 January 2020 (UTC)


 * Comment Please note disagree with the asseement of sources above and giving 3 clear examples as per WP:THREE  Sorry to say I disagree with the assessment above by the nom while do not want comment on each and every one but will give you 3 clear examples. Went the list of all the  articles written by V Ajmal in Deccan Herald here  or Ankita Maneck in First Posthere are clearly independent of all the topics they have written.
 * V Ajmal is a Journalist writing in the Deccan Herald and writes on numerous topics clearly diverse topics as ‘Sumac’ offers authentic Turkish, Afghan dishes to Weight Loss to Kerala Election Victory as seen here and Deccan Herald is WP:RS and this is  not a Press release or an interview  A month to reminisce Dalit contribution to history]
 * Ankita Maneck is a Journalist writing in the First Post and writes on numerous topics which are  clearly diverse topics as seen here   and this is a not a Press release or an interview Ambedkar Jayanti 2017: Here's a look at Dalit History Month to explore forgotten narratives
 * Geetanjali Krishna a journalist writing in the Business Standard and writes on numerous topics which as clearly diverse topics as seen  here and this is a not a Press release or an interview Revisiting stories to revive Dalit history
 * Further as noted by Washington Post that that The News Minute became the first mainstream English media outlet in India to run a Dalit History Month series on caste discrimination, Dalit poetry and art this is being followed by others like The Wire, ThePrint of Shekhar Gupta ,Scroll.in,  even the First Post has written under dalit History month here and this followed by other media outlets also.Pharaoh of the Wizards (talk) 03:20, 11 January 2020 (UTC)
 * "V Ajmal is a Journalist writing in the Deccan Herald", but the article is promotional citing people of the organization and written only to promote it.
 * "Ankita Maneck is a Journalist writing in the First Post", but the article is a clear re-write of the opinion piece from Huffington Post, a total advertisement.
 * "Geetanjali Krishna a journalist writing in the Business Standard"... still the article has same interviews with the closely involved people and the article ultimately reads like an advertisement.
 * Washington Post only mentions a hashtag.
 * If you really want to prove notability this essentially WP:FRINGE subject which promotes historical revisionism, then you would need quality scholarly sources like others have already noted. Not just advertisements. For a name, Black History Month has enough independent coverage from the reliable sources to back up the subject's notability. WalkingDisks (talk) 09:36, 11 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Comment Sorry to say I disagree with you Deccan Herald ,First Post and Business Standard are reliable sources and the Journalists V Ajmal ,Ankita Maneck  and Geetanjali Krishna are clearly independent of the subject and not affilated with the subject   they are not Press releases ,interview ,advertisement and these clearly pass WP:THREE.Please note there are references from academic journals like Television & New Media published by SAGE Publications and CrossCurrents.Pharaoh of the Wizards (talk) 02:41, 12 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Pharaoh of the Wizards (talk) 01:27, 12 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Right in the beginning of WP:THREE, it says: This is an essay on notability. It contains the advice or opinions of one or more Wikipedia contributors. This page is not one of Wikipedia's policies or guidelines, as it has not been thoroughly vetted by the community. And this essay is in userspace, at User:RoySmith/Three best sources. —usernamekiran(talk) 19:18, 17 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete per Dennis. The references above are merely part of the subject's own activism to promote the subject than any coverage which would be totally independent from the subject. Orientls (talk) 15:50, 17 January 2020 (UTC)
 * delete the subject fails notability criteria for events, and general notability criteria as well. It has been going on for 4-5 years, and it doesnt have sustained significant coverage. What I could find is press releases, and interviews. Both of these things can not be used establish notability. Also, "per all the delete votes above". —usernamekiran<b style="letter-spacing:1pt;">(talk)</b> 19:18, 17 January 2020 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. <b style="color:red">Please do not modify it.</b> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.