Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Daniel Gray (2nd nomination)


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   delete. —  Aitias  // discussion 03:16, 31 December 2008 (UTC)

Daniel Gray
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Contested prod. To date, there's not enough to satisfy WP:BAND so fails notability requirements. The sole independent coverage is a blog, and the content of that falls a long way short of any real substance. Nuttah (talk) 15:08, 23 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Living people-related deletion discussions. --Erwin85Bot (talk) 00:01, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Bands and musicians-related deletion discussions.   -- • Gene93k (talk) 06:08, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete, not-notable. Perhaps if truly independent, secondary sources can be found, I'd reconsider, but blogs and MySpace are not reliable sources. --Mr. Vernon (talk) 09:20, 24 December 2008 (UTC)


 * Hi, the independent coverage included is a blog, yes, but it is independent and reliable. It is an EJ blog from Oustage.com, which is a major independent music website. According to the criteria of notability for bands, "This criterion includes published works in all forms" "except for the following:


 * -Any reprints of press releases, other publications where the musician/ensemble talks about themselves, and all advertising that mentions the musician/ensemble, including manufacturers' advertising.[footnotes 3]


 * -Works comprising merely trivial coverage, such as articles that simply report performance dates, release information or track listings, or the publications of contact and booking details in directories.


 * -An article in a school or university newspaper (or similar) would generally be considered trivial but should be evaluated on a case-by-case basis."


 * Clearly the ourstage resource does not include any of these excluded examples, therefore I fail to see how it does not qualify.


 * I do have a question about another form of notability: "#11" - has been placed in rotation on major radio. Must this constitute a certain amount of radioplay? The subject has been played on BBC radio. I don't know if that counts as criteria.


 * Finally, (possibly a longshot) the subject's father is a major, Juno-winning, recording engineer. As this is a major project of his, does it not constitute as noteworthy?


 * thanks for your time, Midnightrambler21 (talk) 22:29, 24 December 2008 (UTC)


 * Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so that consensus may be reached. Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Ron Ritzman (talk) 00:40, 28 December 2008 (UTC)


 * Delete--even if that Ourstage blog were independent, providing significant in-depth coverage. But since the 'article' in question refers to the subject only in one single paragraph (and there's a significant rub, Midnightrambler), it does not suffice. Then, there is no deal with a significant record company, no other coverage, and, finally, notability is not inheritable. Drmies (talk) 02:52, 28 December 2008 (UTC)


 * Hi, thanks for the reply. Even if the article and videoblog is not deemed significant enough, I'd still like to hear back about the BBC thing, since only one criteria has to be accepted for the article to remain. Also, I didn't mean that the notability would be inheritable; I meant that since Gary Gray is a notable Canadian recording engineer, and Daniel Gray's music is one of his projects - meaning that he produces, records and mixes Daniel's music - would it not be considered of note as a major project of Gary's, since he's so involved with the project?


 * If it is deleted though, I'll simply add it again with more info once there is more coverage. Obvioiusly there's not a whole lot yet because he's so new.


 * thanks again, 70.24.139.156 (talk) 07:21, 28 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Hey Rambler--sorry, I indented your paragraphs for clarity. As for the song and airplay, well, it really needs to chart to establish some notability. Sure, airplay for an independent artist is much more meaningful than airplay for, you know, famous old rockers like you and me, but simply being played is not enough, IMO, to satisfy the music criteria. As for the guy's father, his notability would allow perhaps a subsection on the son on the father's page (if he had one), but it doesn't really work the other way around, I don't think. But good luck to him, and to you--and yeah, keep it someplace safe, and when Gray hits the big time, you'll be the first one to have the article ready... thanks, and good luck, Drmies (talk) 23:38, 28 December 2008 (UTC)


 * Delete per WP:N. Oroso (talk)  09:05, 28 December 2008 (UTC)


 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Canada-related deletion discussions.   — Paul Erik  (talk) (contribs) 05:24, 29 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete: notability not established. JamesBurns (talk) 07:00, 29 December 2008 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.