Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Davide Giri


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. I find that the argument that this article does not confirm with BLP1E and CRIME to be both sufficiently supported, and not refuted adequately. This means that consensus exists to delete. Daniel (talk) 04:58, 14 December 2021 (UTC)

Davide Giri

 * – ( View AfD View log | edits since nomination)

no evidence of lasting importance.  DGG ( talk ) 10:54, 5 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete: It's very sad that many people are murdered every day around the world, but there is no indication that this man or his death are of encyclopedia significance. Pam  D  11:12, 5 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Academics and educators-related deletion discussions. Engr.  Smitty   Werben 14:10, 5 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Crime-related deletion discussions. Engr.  Smitty   Werben 14:10, 5 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Computing-related deletion discussions. Engr.  Smitty   Werben 14:10, 5 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Italy-related deletion discussions. Engr.  Smitty   Werben 14:10, 5 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of New York-related deletion discussions. Engr.  Smitty   Werben 14:10, 5 December 2021 (UTC)


 * Delete. WP:NOTMEMORIAL, and doesn't meet the WP:CRIME guidelines.  No sign of WP:NPROF or other notability. Russ Woodroofe (talk) 16:06, 5 December 2021 (UTC)


 * HOLD. as promoter of the article I can only express that this is kept and not canceled. Do you want to erase the remeber of a young scientist who contributed with publications, studies and research to the development of computer science? In this encyclopedia there are more Football players than scientists, also other useless articles. It's sad people die every day from dramatic cases, but some deserve to be remembered, and Davide should be one of them. This article is important for Italy, for me and because it can be useful. No one will ever kneel for Davide. Or maybe you prefer to remember these Italians, Genovese crime family instead of Davide.--Peter39c (talk) 01:55, 6 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Wikipedia is a not a webhost for memorials. Wild accusations about preferences for Mafia are not helpful or relevant. GreaterPonce665  (TALK) 21:38, 8 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Comment. Wikipedia is bound by various WP:N standards. If a mafia group is notable in some way, then Wikipedia can and certainly will have an article on it. WP:NOTCENSORED. WikiJoeB (talk) 01:16, 14 December 2021 (UTC)

You dare to reject this article when you accept articles like this one !! just one line of article for an unknown cricketer, Puran Giri. Nothing against this Puran Giri, but it is just an example. --Peter39c (talk) 02:20, 6 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Puran Giri clearly passes WP:NCRICKET, Using WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS is never a good argument. WWGB (talk) 12:20, 12 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Yes, the rules of Wikipedia are crazy in the relevant "notability" requirements for sportspeople (one professional appearance) and academics (WP:NPROF: not enough to have a list of publications and an appointment as professor, but a real high-flyer). But those are the rules at present. If you can find reliable sources to show that Davide passed WP:NPROF, then please do so. Plenty of brilliant young scientist's articles are deleted as "too soon", though sadly he will not have a chance to build the scientific status which would have supported an article.  Pam  D  08:09, 6 December 2021 (UTC)

Unfortunately, my position, even if reasonable, is a minority, the article must be expanded and completed in its parts, there are other relevant information. Davide was also a discreet football player. I have little time to complete the article and with the certainty that it will be canceled I don't have many incentives to go on, I counted on the help of others, colleagues, friends, relatives but also other academics. But it seems that destiny or fate has already decided, and only I appeal so that it is not forgotten. --Peter39c (talk) 09:13, 6 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete. This kind of strikes home, given that I lived about two blocks from there when I was myself a CS grad student at Columbia. But I don't see evidence of the lasting interest in this event needed to pass WP:CRIME and WP:BIO1E, and it was obviously too early in his career for other notability criteria like WP:PROF. —David Eppstein (talk) 07:52, 6 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Hold. There is ample evidence of the notoriety of the crime being on at least the same order of significance as Murder of Tessa Majors, not all of which has been integrated into this very early stage article as references yet. This crime remained front page news on Italian national newspapers of record for two days on both Corriere della Sera and La Stampa. A direct comparison to the current state of Murder of Tessa Majors is not yet fair given the freshness of the crime itself. Perhaps we should consider a comparison to that article at a snapshot closer to that crime. It was also front page news on national papers in the United States like the New York Post and NY Daily News . It also was referenced on the front page of the NY Times even though the article itself only appeared in the first section . Given the shared foreign nationality of two victims, this crime's profile borders on an international incident in Italy-US relations (cf. Murder of Mario Cerciello Rega). Taken together, this exceeds WP:CRIME. Regarding his notability as an academic, only a fraction of his works have yet been added to the publications section of the article as of yet, and, respectfully, so far no Wikipedians with domain expertise in computer architecture and system design have commented on the importance of and novelty in his experimental and theoretical work in largely understudied area of cache coherence in specialized accelerators (the specialized portions of integrated circuits in modern SoCs that are letting everyone read this discussion right now). The works are all at most three years out from publication, but the recentness of a scientific contribution does not rule out its notability. At this stage, I concede, there is a question of whether the subject of the article should be the career of the victim himself or the crime, which is a valid matter of debate. That said, it is wildly premature to delete it altogether. The article needs more time to be expanded to capture its notability. —trepetti
 * — trepetti (talk&#32;• contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.


 * Comment: see WP:BLP1E (yes, it also applies to people "recently dead") and the Guideline WP:EVENTCRITERIA, in particular point 4: Routine kinds of news events (including most crimes, accidents, deaths, celebrity or political news, "shock" news, stories lacking lasting value such as "water cooler stories," and viral phenomena) – whether or not tragic or widely reported at the time – are usually not notable unless something further gives them additional enduring significance., which explicitly mentions wide coverage at the time as not substantiating notability. Pam  D  10:17, 6 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Thank you for your explanation, but would it be possible to clarify why then this article ought to be deleted when the Murder of Tessa Majors occurred in the same era, 30-acre park and academic institution, had the same potential effect on race relations in the most ethnically diverse city on earth, did not have an international element, and had a victim whose academic career only involved graduating secondary school? As someone largely an outsider on this site, this rule seems to be applied between these incidents (and probably others) in an arbitrary manner. -trepetti
 * To clarify, in this case, it seems reasonable that the article be converted to one on the crime (out of scope for WP:BLP1E) rather than the person, but in this case does such an article get deleted entirely and restarted from scratch? My issue here is with the topic (person or crime) being completely removed from the encyclopedia. -trepetti — Preceding undated comment added 11:03, 6 December 2021 (UTC)
 * For a start, see WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS. Beyond that, there was a discussion at Articles for deletion/Murder of Tessa Majors which narrowly agreed to keep that article, where a lot of arguments are put forward on both sides. I would have !voted "Delete" there. The crimes in both cases seem sad but on the larger scale insignificant. The other one mentioned above, Murder of Mario Cerciello Rega also went to AfD and was kept: there, the fact of  foreigners killing a police officer did make that case stand out. I don't think the two cases add up to a significant incident in Italy–United States relations as was suggested above. Thousands of people, sadly, are murdered in the world every day.  Pam  D  11:16, 6 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Well put, and yes, I can see aspects of both cases that may make them more or less relevant. I will keep my vote to hold to let it be expanded. I think in time, the significance of this murder will be more evident and maybe the issue can be revisited. Morningside Park (Manhattan) has a long history as a point of tension and controversy in the city, unfortunately, so time will tell. trepetti (talk) 11:25, 6 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Clarifying one last point, "international incident" was indeed a misused term, but these kinds of crimes have been in the public consciousness of the two countries because of controversies surrounding the Murder of Meredith Kercher which were brought to the fore again due to the Murder of Mario Cerciello Rega. Not necessarily international in scope but this incident may attract more attention because of the large number of Italians in New York City who are recent arrivals from Italy. trepetti 11:48, 6 December 2021 (UTC)


 * Delete: It is unfortunate that he died, but many people (including students) are stabbed to death everyday, receiving almost no coverage. This has some coverage, but there's no consequencial fundamental policy change etc, so this is not notable. WP:NPROF definitely isn't suitable for a grad student. GreaterPonce665  (TALK) 20:39, 7 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete Wikipedia is not a news site. If there is some long-lasting subject here, maybe an article could be developed on, say, a rise in violent crime after a year of COVID or somesuch. Being a victim of a crime does not make the person notable by encyclopedic standards. One test I like to use is: if someone reads this article in ten years, would they agree the person had a lasting impact? W Nowicki (talk) 00:06, 8 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Comment: Of course you don't give a damn, it's not your compatriot who was murdered and if you keep one-line articles of unknown cricket players, this article can definitely stay in the encyclopedia. It would be his birthday in two days. And I want to give him this gift, not relegate him to the memory of only relatives and close friends. It deserves to be in the encyclopedia among the most deserving and brilliant Italians. In addition there are his numerous researches, studies and publications. --Peter39c (talk) 01:37, 8 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Reply: You want to keep this Wikipedia article as a gift to the subject? I don't want to sound insensitive, but this would not pass WP:POV/WP:IMPARTIAL and other bias-related policies. Their scientific work doesn't fit the notability criteria of NPROF. GreaterPonce665  (TALK) 14:45, 8 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Comment. "Of course you don't give a damn..."? AfD is not the place for language like this. WikiJoeB (talk) 01:20, 14 December 2021 (UTC)


 * Hold it for now. I am well aware that there are not enough reasons to keep it but if that guy published something useful / important and more over if he was a promising figure in that field (computer science), why not keep this article for some more time (e.g. a couple of months) just to see if there is something more notable? What does not convince me is the title; maybe that page could be referenced by another article about innocent / casual victims of crimes (killed without a real reason); in practice the title should be something else than just Name Surname, maybe something more specific such as Murder of Name Surname (New York). That guy was italian but I have not found an article about him in italian wiki so maybe an article might be written there.  At the end of the day even if I totally agree with the fact that maybe the dead person was not notable enough to gain an article in (en) wikipedia, that wikipedia is not a news site, etc. I have to add my personal opinion in order to show a different perspective on this subject. GreaterPonce665: It is unfortunate that he died, but many people (including students) are stabbed to death everyday, receiving almost no coverage. (ok, it must be "the silence of lambs", temporarily without a shepherd, ... as usual). Do you want to know why these kind of murders are notable? It's because they happen because of the fact that too many souls have been far from God for too much time and so its enemy can do, directly or indirectly, these kind of evil things (murderer was filled with immeasurable hatred and distorted thoughts);  yes, deaths attributed to COVID have the same cause because evil kills in many ways. ade56facc (talk) 03:35, 8 December 2021 (UTC)

— 151.44.16.101 (talk) has made few or no other edits outside this topic. WWGB (talk) 04:51, 14 December 2021 (UTC) Hi. I read the linked policy references you provided but I do not see how BLP1E or WHATABOUTX fit here. There are scientific results achieved by that man albeit limited in number by a premature death. References to those results and to the author should be kept in his page. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 151.36.7.95 (talk) 15:07, 10 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Hold it. My 1st search for his name took me on the wiki page here and I finally *knew* who that guy was. Isn't wikepedia out there to globally share knowledge? If instead the goal is the discussion on formal categorization or missing professional achievements I am afraid that something is not working (besides the obvious fact that a killed person has no chances anymore to improve his or her skills even if he / she desired to do that). The point is that hate and ignorance which took to this absurd murder without reasons, like too many others unfortunately, must not make us think it's normal. It's an increasing serious problem we must take into account and that we can't forget. Deleting knowledge is to first step to accept violence and possibly be violent as well. Many references could be made to this page one day as there was a young man striving to make a better world on one hand and on the other one there is the social problem of people far away from human beings, and this must be documented and remembered. /c.f./ — Preceding unsigned comment added by 151.44.16.101 (talk) 01:36, 10 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Hi, please see WP:EVENTCRIT, WP:BLP1E or WP:WHATABOUTX. GreaterPonce665  (TALK) 13:32, 10 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Comment. Wikipedia does aim to provide knowledge, but not the sum of all knowledge. Certain notability guidelines, such as WP:GNG, must be met for an article to remain on Wikipedia. WikiJoeB (talk) 01:24, 14 December 2021 (UTC)


 * Their scientific work doesn't fit the notability criteria of WP:NPROF. GreaterPonce665  (TALK) 16:34, 10 December 2021 (UTC)


 * Delete. Tragic case but notability is not attained: WP:BLP1E. Xxanthippe (talk) 04:55, 11 December 2021 (UTC).


 * Keep - well sourced article with coverage in newspapers of record such as il Corriere della Sera and La Stampa in Italy and The New York Times in the United States. If this is not the very definition of notability, then what is? XavierItzm (talk) 15:32, 11 December 2021 (UTC)


 * See my post of 10:17 am, 6 December 2021 above. Pam  D  16:23, 11 December 2021 (UTC)
 * The thing to ponder, Pam, is that the media considers the killing of Davide Giri and of Tessa Majors to be related.  In fact, The New York Times says the killing of Giri is a reprise of the murder of Majors.  You can't argue against the sources.XavierItzm (talk) 16:30, 11 December 2021 (UTC)


 * Hold as I consider the article is notable and attracted significant media coverage. Appears to meet and even exceed the standards of WP:CRIME.Such-change47 (talk) 08:53, 13 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Weak delete. There is a problem that these days any murder in the First World will generate some coverage. But in the end, this is WP:ONEEVENT, and overall failure of WP:NBIO, unless her death is shown to have some lasting media coverage that doesn't die out after a few days. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 11:02, 13 December 2021 (UTC)
 * @Piotrus: his death not her death.
 * IMHO, as I already (partially) stated before/above, hold/keep it if and only if: 1) title of article is renamed to "Murder of Davide Giri (NYC)" (or something like that in order to match that of Murder of Tessa Majors); 2) article is improved in that direction (more murder details); 3) someone is willing to improve article Crime in New York City (History, 2010s, 2020s) also by splitting it into sub-articles and adding links to articles about murder of people like Davide, Tessa and others that received extensive media coverage; this not because those people were better than other but just as examples that those kind of deaths are always a great loss for society and that maybe there is something really wrong in how certain trends are left evolving.  If at least those 3 conditions are not met (within a few weeks or at most a couple of months) then I am not against deleting article. ade56facc (talk) 11:23, 13 December 2021 (UTC)


 * Delete. One event applies. Wikipedia is not a memorial. Stifle (talk) 15:36, 13 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete Ultimately, I find the "known for only one thing" and "Wikipedia is not a memorial" lines of argument convincing. Sources comparing this event to a previous event (in an obvious, surface-level manner) don't really amount to persistent interest in this event. Frankly, there are better ways to honor the dead than Wikipedia pages. XOR&#39;easter (talk) 00:32, 14 December 2021 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.