Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Diary of a Supernatural


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was Delete for current failure to meet notability requirements. (Similarly to the recent deletion of the artist's page). — Cactus Writer (talk) 17:42, 22 September 2017 (UTC)

Diary of a Supernatural

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Song for a rapper whose main article was deleted. Talk page raises doubts about non-notability, so I'm bringing this to AFD instead of CSD. Magog the Ogre (t • c) 03:14, 7 September 2017 (UTC)
 * Did you try to assess notability yourself WP:BEFORE nominating? There are a lot of reviews cited. Did you look specifically at the 4 I referenced on the talk page. What is your assessment of these? ~Kvng (talk) 14:33, 7 September 2017 (UTC)
 * @Kvng: I did, actually! I am suspicious these might in fact be a WP:WALLEDGARDEN of self-publicity. But I admittedly don't know if these are genuine publicity or just a walled garden, since I am not up on the rap music scene. That's why I'm bringing it up for discussion. Magog the Ogre (t • c) 00:55, 9 September 2017 (UTC)


 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Nigeria-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 04:22, 7 September 2017 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Albums and songs-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 04:22, 7 September 2017 (UTC)


 * Keep - Sources are adequate and reliable enough to establish notability. I have searched for these sources here on WP and a couple (HipHopDX, HotNewHipHop) have WP articles. The others are used as sources for other hip-hop WP articles. Certainly not a WP:WALLEDGARDEN as suspected by the nom. ~Kvng (talk) 14:18, 9 September 2017 (UTC)


 * Keep for points laid out by Kvng. Article clearly passes GNG MustaphaNG (talk) 14:56, 9 September 2017 (UTC)
 * Delete fails the requirements for WP:N (music) - WP is not the marketing arm for launching new careers in the music industry. Atsme 📞📧 18:34, 10 September 2017 (UTC)
 * Weak Keep:Despite not having a strong interest in music generally lately, I still expect to have heard of all Nigerian musicians worthy of WP articles, especially Hip-hop. I consider it strange and to a lesser extent suspicious that I've never heard of the artist behind this album until today. That being said, the references in the article show coverage, but they are mostly non-Nigerian hip hop-related references, would highly benefit from coverage from mainstream newspaper and entertainment sites in Nigeria.


 * My reason for making this vote weak is based on personal bias judgement, not policy or guideline. Nevertheless, I'll love to know if has listened to any of his music or heard of him before now? Darreg (talk) 10:07, 11 September 2017 (UTC)
 * I try as much as possible not to settle for what the mainstream offers and i usually dig deep to listen to quality hip hop. That way i catch up with artists who have been making waves in the underground. He actually has been covered by some newspapers. [here] and [here] and I've seen his works with the likes of Mode 9, Weird MC, Terry Tha Rapman, Boogey, A-Q etc. I think having international publications all depends on the target audience or maybe where the artist is based. MustaphaNG (talk) 12:06, 11 September 2017 (UTC)
 * Is he not based in Nigeria? Darreg (talk) 18:48, 11 September 2017 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks,  J 947(c) (m) 18:01, 14 September 2017 (UTC)
 * Delete. The album fails WP:NALBUM. I was able to find two sources that reviewed the album, but it appears that these sources are not reliable. The Creative-hiphop.com and Rapstation.com sources do not have editorial oversight., I have never heard of this artist. He's not a well known rapper in Nigeria. There are tons of rap acts in Nigeria without stand-alone articles that are more popular than this guy.  Versace1608   Wanna Talk? 07:10, 15 September 2017 (UTC)
 * Please don't use an WP:OTHERSTUFF argument. Articles for other notable Nigerian rappers will be created in due course.
 * What leads you to conclude the sources are unreliable? ~Kvng (talk) 14:37, 15 September 2017 (UTC)
 * I am not using that as an argument. I was simply replying to Darreg who asked me a question. I am well aware that popularity is not synonymous with notability. A subject being popular doesn't mean that they deserve a Wikipedia page. There are currently eight references in the article. The first reference is simply a press release about the subject releasing a brief trailer for the album, and doesn't discuss the album. The second reference is an album review of the album. While it is a well-written review, the notability of the website itself is in question. For starters, the website's About Us page doesn't show the website having editorial oversight. As a matter of fact, the website is a promotional platform that has no criteria when it comes to the writers they accept (the website currently has one contributor and an editor-in-chief). Anyone who "got the plug on the latest hiphop happenings in their city/country, or is hungry and looking to create a name for himself/herself in the hip hop community" can become a writer. The third reference shows the album's page at AllMusic; nothing reliable there. The fourth reference is a highly-promotional opinion piece review of the album. Here is an excerpt from the review: "In a world where hip hop has been misconceived and abused, MCskill ThaPreacha resurrects hip hop (in Africa and around the world) on this epic Pan-African hip-hop "Diary Of A Supernatural" album. MCskill presents hip hop as a glorious magnificent craft risen from its ashes of commercialism and flabbergasted flamboyance and immersed in immateriality. It tells a tale of a gatekeeper (Master of the Arts) who rises from glory to glory in his quest to enlighten and break-the-chains of mental slavery in all peoples of the world through his conscious heart-throbbing music." How can someone who isn't known in his native country or around the world resurrect a genre that has been around since the 70s? The review cited above isn't a professional review in any way, shape, or form. It is simply a review meant to promote the album. Words and phrases such as "glorious magnificent craft" and "ashes of commercialism and flabbergasted flamboyance and immersed in immateriality" are not included in professional reviews. The fifth reference is an album review from SpitFireHipHop, an unreliable website with no editorial oversight. The sixth reference is a simply a music post. The HNHH post doesn't discuss the single whatsoever. The HNHH staff who created the page simply copied and pasted a promotional biography of the subject that has been circulated on various platforms. Evidence of the circulated bio can be seen [https://www.google.com/search?q=MCskill+ThaPreacha+(Real+names+Olawale+Aremo)+is+an+Emcee+and+a+Writer+currently+based+in+Lagos%2C+Nigeria.+He+has+been+in+the+Nigerian+Hip+Hop+scene+officially+since+2010.+He+released+his+debut+mixtape+titled+%E2%80%9CMetaphysical+Induction%E2%80%9D+in+2011+featuring+Synik+from+Zimbabwe%2C+Wale+and+Jetlag+from+Texas%2C+US.+The+great+feedback+prompted+him+to+record+another+mixtape+in+2012+titled+%E2%80%9CGet+Dope+Or+Die+Wack%E2%80%9D+which+featured+Mista+Dry+Gin+from+the+UK%2C+Mschief%2C+Protek%2C+Rez+ThaPoet+etc.+Both+mixtapes+were+hosted+by+veteran+producer+%E2%80%9CStormatique%E2%80%9D.+In+February+2013%2C+MCskill+teamed+up+with+MC+Magic+Man+%2C+a+PH+city+emcee+to+put+out+a+massive+Hip+Hop+EP+titled+%E2%80%9CProject-X%E2%80%9D+hosted+by+%E2%80%9CStormatique%2C+Teck-Zilla+Of+Str8buttah+%26+M.P%E2%80%9D+which+featured+legendary+emcee+%E2%80%9CModenine%E2%80%9D+and+veteran+emcee+Psalmurai.+In+June+of+the+same+year+he+released+his+fourth+project+titled+%E2%80%9CFree+Throws+(Guest+artistes+Aina+More%2C+Lord+V%2C+Cyrus+Tha+Virus+etc.)+which+was+also+hosted+by+Stormatique.+In+2014%2C+MCskill+announced+the+%E2%80%9DDiary+Of+A+Supernatural%E2%80%9D+album+for+a+June+release+but+failed+to+deliver+but+he+was+able+to+please+his+fans+and+critics+when+he+released+a+volume+2+to+the+earlier+released+Free+Throws+project+in+November+to+celebrate+the+Hip+Hop+History+month.+Free+Throws+2+featured+Nigerian+Hip+Hop+legends+%E2%80%9CWeird+MC+and+Terry+Tha+Rapman(T.R)%E2%80%9D+and+also+had+buzzing+underground+emcees+%E2%80%9CMagic+Man%2C+High+M+and+Butafly%E2%80%9D+on+it.+Now+heavily+affiliated+with+the+Temple+Of+Hip+Hop%2C+MCskill+ThaPreacha+teamed+up+with+producer+and+long+time+COLLABORATOR+%E2%80%9CStormatique%E2%80%9D+in+January+2015+to+work+on+his+sixth+project+titled+%E2%80%9CThe+Season+EP%E2%80%9D.+A+single+off+the+project+with+the+same+title+%E2%80%9CThe+Season%E2%80%9D+was+released.+Str8buttah%E2%80%99s+DJ+Teck-Zilla+provided+scratches+and+samples+on+the+record+and+by+February%2C+the+record+was+featured+on+Public+Enemy+Chuck+D%E2%80%99s+PEPR+radio+show.+The+Season+EP+was+released+on+March+11th+with+guest+artistes+like+Boogey%2C+Khaligraph+Jones+from+Kenya%2C+Desire+Nobility+from+the+Temple+Of+Hip+Hop%2C+Fazillion%2C+Kelani+and+Sigrin+Royce+all+showing+their+skills+on+it.+The+much+anticipated+%E2%80%9CDiary+Of+A+Supernatural%E2%80%9D+album+is+expected+to+be+released+in+the+summer+of+2016.+MCskill+ThaPreacha&oq=MCskill+ThaPreacha+(Real+names+Olawale+Aremo)+is+an+Emcee+and+a+Writer+currently+based+in+Lagos%2C+Nigeria.+He+has+been+in+the+Nigerian+Hip+Hop+scene+officially+since+2010.+He+released+his+debut+mixtape+titled+%E2%80%9CMetaphysical+Induction%E2%80%9D+in+2011+featuring+Synik+from+Zimbabwe%2C+Wale+and+Jetlag+from+Texas%2C+US.+The+great+feedback+prompted+him+to+record+another+mixtape+in+2012+titled+%E2%80%9CGet+Dope+Or+Die+Wack%E2%80%9D+which+featured+Mista+Dry+Gin+from+the+UK%2C+Mschief%2C+Protek%2C+Rez+ThaPoet+etc.+Both+mixtapes+were+hosted+by+veteran+producer+%E2%80%9CStormatique%E2%80%9D.+In+February+2013%2C+MCskill+teamed+up+with+MC+Magic+Man+%2C+a+PH+city+emcee+to+put+out+a+massive+Hip+Hop+EP+titled+%E2%80%9CProject-X%E2%80%9D+hosted+by+%E2%80%9CStormatique%2C+Teck-Zilla+Of+Str8buttah+%26+M.P%E2%80%9D+which+featured+legendary+emcee+%E2%80%9CModenine%E2%80%9D+and+veteran+emcee+Psalmurai.+In+June+of+the+same+year+he+released+his+fourth+project+titled+%E2%80%9CFree+Throws+(Guest+artistes+Aina+More%2C+Lord+V%2C+Cyrus+Tha+Virus+etc.)+which+was+also+hosted+by+Stormatique.+In+2014%2C+MCskill+announced+the+%E2%80%9DDiary+Of+A+Supernatural%E2%80%9D+album+for+a+June+release+but+failed+to+deliver+but+he+was+able+to+please+his+fans+and+critics+when+he+released+a+volume+2+to+the+earlier+released+Free+Throws+project+in+November+to+celebrate+the+Hip+Hop+History+month.+Free+Throws+2+featured+Nigerian+Hip+Hop+legends+%E2%80%9CWeird+MC+and+Terry+Tha+Rapman(T.R)%E2%80%9D+and+also+had+buzzing+underground+emcees+%E2%80%9CMagic+Man%2C+High+M+and+Butafly%E2%80%9D+on+it.+Now+heavily+affiliated+with+the+Temple+Of+Hip+Hop%2C+MCskill+ThaPreacha+teamed+up+with+producer+and+long+time+COLLABORATOR+%E2%80%9CStormatique%E2%80%9D+in+January+2015+to+work+on+his+sixth+project+titled+%E2%80%9CThe+Season+EP%E2%80%9D.+A+single+off+the+project+with+the+same+title+%E2%80%9CThe+Season%E2%80%9D+was+released.+Str8buttah%E2%80%99s+DJ+Teck-Zilla+provided+scratches+and+samples+on+the+record+and+by+February%2C+the+record+was+featured+on+Public+Enemy+Chuck+D%E2%80%99s+PEPR+radio+show.+The+Season+EP+was+released+on+March+11th+with+guest+artistes+like+Boogey%2C+Khaligraph+Jones+from+Kenya%2C+Desire+Nobility+from+the+Temple+Of+Hip+Hop%2C+Fazillion%2C+Kelani+and+Sigrin+Royce+all+showing+their+skills+on+it.+The+much+anticipated+%E2%80%9CDiary+Of+A+Supernatural%E2%80%9D+album+is+expected+to+be+released+in+the+summer+of+2016.+MCskill+ThaPreacha&aqs=chrome..69i57.452j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8 here]. The seventh reference is simply a music post about the artist's "Man in the Mirror" song. HipHopDX does not review or discuss the song. The eighth reference is a well-written album review. However, the notability of Rapstation.com should be brought into question because there is no information about the website having editorial oversight. Of the eight references cited in the article, only the second and eight can be considered for acceptance. However, in order for them to be accepted, proof needs to be shown that said references have editorial oversight. As it stands, the album fails WP:NALBUM. It didn't chart on any country's official music chart, didn't win nor was nominated for any notable award, and hasn't been reviewed by a reliable publication.  Versace1608   Wanna Talk? 16:08, 15 September 2017 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the detailed rundown. Sounds like your position on some of the more promising references is that they're assumed to be unreliable until there's evidence to the contrary. My own assumptions are a bit more forgiving. ~Kvng (talk) 18:02, 15 September 2017 (UTC)
 * Me i think when specific notability guidelines in wp:nalbums and wp:nsongs are clearly not met, we shouldn't be lenient in our interpretation of significant coverage and sources. If he passed specific guidelines, such as nom/won award, charting, etc. I wouldn't have had a problem with the references. Darreg (talk) 10:54, 16 September 2017 (UTC)


 * Speedy delete: a case of A9. Furthermore, cited footnotes are press releases and reviews from primary sources. —Oluwa2Chainz »» (talk to me) 23:04, 21 September 2017 (UTC)
 * Leaning towards delete, but... I think that this artist is not notable enough yet to be a wiki article. But maybe in the future he can become more notable and then return for a wiki page. The sources are very few considering that the album has been out for almost a year. Surely some more coverage would have surfaced by now.Huitzilopochtli1990 (talk) 02:04, 22 September 2017 (UTC)
 * Delete for failing notability guidelines. Also, I'll dredge out WP:TOOSOON. Ifnord (talk) 16:45, 22 September 2017 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.