Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Drake–Dayton football rivalry


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   delete.  Sandstein  21:20, 10 December 2011 (UTC)

Drake–Dayton football rivalry

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Has only one source, and no independent sources. Furthermore, doesn't really attest to why it is a rivalry game per se. The schools have only met 28 times (relatively low for a "rivalry"), and the vast majority of those were in Pioneer Football League play. Until I see an independent source that says that these two are rivals, I will recommend that this article be deleted  Purpleback pack  89  ≈≈≈≈  20:58, 1 December 2011 (UTC)  Purpleback  pack  89  ≈≈≈≈  20:58, 1 December 2011 (UTC)
 * I am also nominating Northern Iowa–Southern Illinois rivalry for deletion. Same rationale applies, except replace "Pioneer Football League" with Missouri Valley Football Conference.  Just because two teams are in the same conference and one of them often wins the conference doesn't necessarily make it a rivalry game  Purpleback  pack  89  ≈≈≈≈  21:24, 1 December 2011 (UTC)
 * I am also nominating Drake–Iowa rivalry as it appears to be partially a copy of Drake-Dayton rivalry, isn't independently sourced, and because it's only been played once in the last 60 years, and only a handful of times twice since Drake and Iowa were MVIAA mates a century ago. (Back then, UCLA was playing Whittier College; we don't have a UCLA-Whittier College rivalry)  Purpleback  pack  89  ≈≈≈≈  00:28, 2 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of American football-related deletion discussions.  —Tom Morris (talk) 21:16, 1 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Delete rivalry articles are okay, but they should provide more than just the win-loss records. Try another wiki--Paul McDonald (talk) 22:10, 1 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Delete - A quick google search reveals Dayton doesn't seem to consider Drake anything more than a fellow member of the PFL. As far as I know, the only true rivalry in that conference is the Butler-Valparaiso game, the winner of which is awarded the Hoosier Helmet.  City boy77 (talk) 22:27, 1 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Delete ALL. Technically, the number of meetings in CFB rivalry series has nothing to do with its notability per WP:GNG and WP:NSPORTS.  The rivalry itself, separate and apart from routine coverage of the individual games, must have received significant and meaningful coverage in verifiable, reliable sources per WP:V and WP:RS.  That's a much tougher standard than we have been enforcing in the past regarding these rivalry articles.  For purposes of establishing notability, that means mainstream published sources, and probably excludes team media guides, school newspapers and yearbooks as "self-published" by the subject.  This AfD should just be the first of twenty or more CFB rivarly articles that get purged through the AfD process for failing to meet WP:GNG and WP:NSPORTS.  Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 23:12, 1 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Well, first two...feel free to nominate a few more  Purpleback pack  89  ≈≈≈≈  23:31, 1 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Side comment I'm all in favor of more nominations, but I'd like to keep it down to a few at a time, rather than to blast a bunch all at once. There is no deadline.--Paul McDonald (talk) 23:32, 1 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Aside. Agreed, Paul.  I have a list of 20+ CFB rivalry articles that I plan to introduce for discussion at the CFB talk page, gain a consensus there, and then send them over here to AfD as a done deal.  I plan to submit 4 or 5 at a time, if that doesn't seem like too many to you.  Purplebackpack jumped in and volunteered to lead the charge on this one, but there are more coming.  BTW, I would be happy to share the AfD target list with you off-wiki.  You no doubt will have suggestions of your own for AfDs.  Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 23:47, 1 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Delete all three. The spawning of "rivalry" articles has gotten out of control.  In order to satisfy WP:GNG, such articles should be limited to true rivalries that receive significant and sustained coverage, with the coverage being focused on the rivalry.  Separate rivalry articles aren't warranted just because two teams play each other every year and the local newspapers print articles about those games.  I agree with Dirtlawyer that there are a number of similar rivalry articles that are appropriate for deletion.  In order to permit careful consideration, limiting them to a few at a time is appropriate. Cbl62 (talk) 06:41, 2 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Further note: As Paul mentions, many "rivalry" articles do nothing more than recite the results of games year by year.  Those sorts of listings are readily available in each college's football media guides (usually available on-line) and statistics databases.  See, e.g. College Football Data Warehouse listings that provide the exact same data (without the eye-wearying colors in the Wikipedia versions): Drake-Iowa, Drake-Dayton.  No good reason to duplicate these lists on Wikipedia with dayglow rainbow coloring. Cbl62 (talk) 06:52, 2 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Question Has anyone tried to ask the person who created the article what they think is significant about it? I agree that there has to be a limit to rivalry articles otherwise inter-office softball teams will begin to get articles.  However, rivalries- especially in college sports are important to the people involved and of little concern to outsiders. Drake/Dayton is no Michigan/Ohio State but without clearly defined criteria it seems hard to limit this particular kind of thing. Elmmapleoakpine (talk) 22:49, 2 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Comment. EMOP, there is already a standard provided by WP:GNG and WP:NSPORTS.  It's just not been enforced with regard to these CFB rivalry articles, and the WP:CFB project editors are now taking steps to correct that.  Before we are done, all 200+ CFB rivalry articles will be evaluated.  As for the article creator's subjective opinion, it really doesn't matter unless he can provide evidence of significant coverage of these rivalry series, separate and apart from routine coverage of the games in the series, in verifiable, reliable sources per WP:V and WP:RS.  If you are unfamiliar with the notability standards as applied to athletes and sporting events, you should familiarize yourself.  Unlike certain classes of professional athletes, there is no presumption of notability; as WP:NSPORTS expressly states: "Sports rivalries are not inherently notable."  Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 23:03, 2 December 2011 (UTC)
 * I assume you are referring to this "Rivalries- Sports rivalries are not inherently notable. Articles on sports rivalries, such as Yankees – Red Sox rivalry, should satisfy the general notability guideline, and additionally must show why the rivalry is important with multiple non-trivial, reliable sources." That is pretty clearly to me therefore I have to vote to delete. Elmmapleoakpine (talk) 23:45, 6 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Delete. Elmmapleoakpine (talk) 23:45, 6 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Delete as not being covered in detail by multiple independent third party sources. If such sources are found and integrated into the article, feel free to ping my talk page. Stuartyeates (talk) 06:32, 8 December 2011 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.