Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Ed Clarke


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   delete.  Kurykh  01:14, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

Ed Clarke

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He is a non notable footballer from a non professional league. Although rookie listed with Sydney he did not play a game for their senior team. Claims such as his selection as an All-Australian are false as is the intro stating him to be a 'a professional Australian rules footballer' Crickettragic (talk) 07:18, 26 June 2008 (UTC)


 * Comment - Firstly Ed Clarke is 'a professional Australian rules footballer'. Playing a sport full time as your fulltime job for a professional team. If that isnt profesional what is?
 * Secondly the "All Australian" claim is true, I will update is to be for the under 18s All Australian side but it is still ALL AUSTRALIAN.
 * This wiki has not been finished yet and I am in the process of finishing it. Some details need to be corrected but they are not blatent lies. Just because a player is not playing in the top league of the world doesnt mean that they are not a notable player. The O&M league is the 4th most popular and most followed league of Australian Rules football in the world. If you only believe that players playing in the highest league of any sport should be on this site, then go ahead and delete any soccer player who isnt playing in the English Premier League. I have followed the guidlines of wikipedia, I am using references of creditable sources. What more can be done to prove that this Article deserves to stay published on wikipedia. Byrne 86 (talk) 10:48, 26 June 2008 (UTC) Byrne 86


 * Comment - He does not play for a professional team though, both Wangaratta and the Northern Bullants are in semi-professional leagues and thus their players do not suit the criteria for a wikipedia article ... as stated here. I appreciate that you have not completed the article but unless he has some other claim to notability than what has already been mentioned then he is not worthy of an article on wikipedia.
 * Players from the WAFL and SANFL (post 1990 with the formation of the AFL), two of the three leagues more popular than the O&M league are also not notable enough for inclusion unless they have won a Sandover or Magarey Medal, although even then it's debatable. So please don't think I am trying to undervalue the O&M league, I'm just following the guidelines that have been in place here for years where only athletes from a fully professional league are notable. Crickettragic (talk) 12:31, 26 June 2008 (UTC)


 * Comment does being All-Australian make him notable? It is verifiable, I just don't know if it's enough to make a difference. I declined the speedy because it's certainly an asserion of notability even if it doesn't meet WP:ATHLETE in the end. TravellingCarithe Busy Bee 13:06, 26 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment This was at an Under 18 (i.e. junior) level. -- Mattinbgn\talk 10:46, 27 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete thanks for the clarification. That information and the league comparisons below make it clear to me that he doesn't pass WP:ATHLETE. As someone who doesn't "get" AFL despite having lived in Australia, I may have erred on declining the speedy but to me it asserted some notability. TravellingCarithe Busy Bee 02:34, 28 June 2008 (UTC)


 * Comment - his All-Australian selection was in Under-18 level so it doesn't make him notable. Crickettragic (talk) 13:16, 26 June 2008 (UTC)


 * Comment - I dont know if he is notable enough for wikipedia as I dont really know the sport but it does seems as if he has a lot written about him on the internet. eg [] and []. It also says something about him getting the Did Simpson []. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mrfashion (talk • contribs) 08:41, 27 June 2008 (UTC)


 * Comment - Mrfashion do you want to make it any more obvious that you are a sockpuppet? Crickettragic (talk) 09:22, 27 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete Does not meet WP:BIO for athletes. he did not play at a fully professional level or at the highest level possible. -- Mattinbgn\talk 10:44, 27 June 2008 (UTC)

Who are YOU to judge what a professional is? Byrne 86 (talk) 12:33, 27 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment, Sorry Mattinbgn, would you consider the A league the highest level of soccer? no it is a substandard league for those people who cant make any league out side of australia, why then are players in this league allowed a wiki article about them? Most of them are less notable then Ed Clarke and are paid less then he was at sydney and about the same as he is now. He is a fully profesional player, trains full time. The definition of professional is -following an occupation as a means of livelyhood or for gain []
 * Deleteper WP:ATHLETE.  Gtstricky Talk or C 14:23, 27 June 2008 (UTC)

Delete per Gtstricky and Point of view pushing --Numyht (talk) 17:38, 27 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Australia-related deletion discussions.  -- --Bduke (talk) 00:24, 28 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete It is incredulous to suggest that the Ovens & Murray Football League, a country-based Aussie Rules comp, can be compared with professional competitions such as football's A-league. The latter has national live television coverage, has managed attendances over 50,000 for Sydney-Melbourne games and last season averaged nearly 15,000 attendance across all games.  It's hard to imagine that say Myrtleford (pop 3,500) v Yarrawonga (pop 3,500) has similar import, and difficult to accept that this comp would be capable of supporting "professional" sportsmen. The arguments re SANFL and WAFL also ring true.  Clearly fails WP:ATHLETE in my view. Murtoa (talk) 01:42, 28 June 2008 (UTC)

The Ovens and Murray Leagues grand final draws in excess of 15 000 spectators. It has a very strong following throughout country Victoria and NSW and has a large amount of television, radio and newspaper coverage. Who are you all to decide that this is not of any importance. To the people living in these areas this league is as important as the AFL. Albury has a population of over 46 000, Wangaratta has a population of around 16 000, Wodonga has a population of over 40 000, the Alpine Shire has around 18 000. This isnt including all the towns surounding the areas of the teams. My point is that this league is of importance. Just because it is not your opinion that this league is important doesnt make it so. People should be able to find information about this league and its players through wikipedia. AFL is not the only league of Aussie Rules that is notable. Byrne 86 (talk) 07:50, 28 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Regardless of your thoughts on the O&M (and for the record, the GVFL is probably stronger nowadays), it is not a fully professional league. WP:ATHLETE says: "Competitors who have competed in a fully professional league ...". Most, if not all, players in the O&M earn the majority of their income from other sources and therefore Clarke does not meet the guideline. The league is notable, arguably the clubs (such as Yarrawonga Football Club) are notable, the players just don't cut it. -- Mattinbgn\talk 08:40, 28 June 2008 (UTC)

SO if a player plays football as their fulltime job then they are a full profesional? Well then he is, its his full time job. Ask anybody who follows that league about ed clarke and they will know who he is Byrne 86 (talk) 08:58, 28 June 2008 (UTC)
 * You have missed the point. It doesn't matter if he is a full-time professional (and I would be surprised if he or anyone else in the OMFL was), but whether he plays in a fully professional league.  It is quite clear that he does not and never has. -- Mattinbgn\talk 09:30, 28 June 2008 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.