Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Edgar Harrell


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was this is a tough one. On the one hand, he wrote a book, but it's self-published. It's in libraries, but sources haven't been found. Even DGG, who argued to keep, seems to only be arguing it weakly (with the aptly titled "week keep"). Since notability has failed to have been definitely established by both sides, and the consensus leans slightly to delete, I am closing this as delete. Wizardman 01:02, 23 April 2009 (UTC)

Edgar Harrell

 * ( [ delete] ) – (View AfD) (View log)

This unreferenced BLP fails WP:N and WP:BIO as no significant discussion can be found of him in independant, reliable sources. He hasn't made the news and a regular google search only turns up some promotional and/or unreliable mentions of the book he wrote. It also appears that this article was created with a conflict of interest from User:Xulonpress with the intent on promoting the book that he wrote.  Them From  Space  19:06, 8 April 2009 (UTC)


 * Comments. OCLC WorldCat does show that 50 libraries, mostly public in the US, do have the book. Edgar Harrell is not the author, an apparent relative, David Harrell wrote this "as told to by Edgar Harrell." The sinking of the USS Indianapolis (CA-35), and being a survivor, is somewhat of a big deal. I'd say the subject of this biography should be considered about the same level as a survivor of the Titanic. That being said, I can't find a list of survivors to verify that Edgar Harrell is one. Independent sources citing him are likely to be in the print universe, or in old newspapers. --Quartermaster (talk) 19:23, 8 April 2009 (UTC)


 * Comment We do not  have an article on everyone who survived. the Titanic-- see List of passengers on board RMS Titanic, and I think there would be some objections to making it automatic--though as each of them was probably interviewed extensively at least in local sources, they probably would meet the General Notability Guideline, and, as all but one of them are now dead,  would not be subject to BLP1E. I can't tell how ONE EVENT and NOT NEWS would be interpreted for this, as their use seems to be arbitrary and inconsistent. DGG (talk) 21:40, 8 April 2009 (UTC)


 * Weak Keep There are about 30 books in Worldcat about the USS Indianapolis (CA35). The best known seems to be "In harm's way : the sinking of the USS Indianapolis and the extraordinary story of its survivors" by Doug Stanton. Any of them might well contain additional information about him. Proof of his being there and a survivor is at . I would solve the dilemma of whether to include every survivor, here or in the titanic, by including at least those about whom an individual book had been written and published, including autobiographies. This one, true, is self-published, but is apparently of enough interest that multiple libraries have bought it, which they rarely do for self-published books.   DGG (talk) 22:14, 8 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so consensus may be reached. Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Stifle (talk) 08:56, 14 April 2009 (UTC)
 * This AfD nomination was incomplete (missing step 3). It is listed now. DumbBOT (talk) 13:52, 15 April 2009 (UTC)


 * Weak Delete No evidence the book achieved notability, or that the author did. From the guideline Notability (people):"A person is presumed to be notable if he or she has been the subject of published[3] secondary source material which is reliable, intellectually independent,[4] and independent of the subject.[5]" Writing a book does not guarantee an encyclopedia article about either the book or the author. Being on a ship sunk in a war likewise does not provide inherent notability. Surviving a catastrophe does not provide automatic notability, any more than being killed in such an event does. That said, the entire book can be read at Google Books and I have no doubt of Harrell being a survivor of the sinking. He says (p162) that an interview with him was published in the Louisville Times, August 15, 1945. Someone with access to microfilm of the paper could verify the basic survivor status by finding it. But being a survivor of a ship sinking would in no way show that he should have an article.  Edison (talk) 16:51, 15 April 2009 (UTC)
 * the argument is that he is more notable than the others, because he wrote a book on it. DGG (talk) 22:25, 22 April 2009 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.