Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Edinburgh University Conservative and Unionist Association


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   redirect to University of Edinburgh. delete &redirect Spartaz Humbug! 21:09, 29 June 2014 (UTC)

Edinburgh University Conservative and Unionist Association

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Student organization is not notable on its own. Propose delete and redirect to University of Edinburgh. Ahecht ( TALK PAGE ) 21:02, 11 June 2014 (UTC)


 * Redirect to University of Edinburgh per nom. —Davey 2010→    ✉   22:19, 11 June 2014 (UTC)

This is notable on it's own, the details of previous years will be added shortly but the forthcoming year holds the Referendum debate with politicians from BetterTogether & YesScotland. Peter Hitchens is speaking at the Association, it's actively involved in the University & the page is required to inform people of the Society. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Hughesejs (talk • contribs) 09:23, 12 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Comment. My understanding is that virtually every university in the UK has a Conservative Association. Whilst OUCA is undoubtedly significant, and CUCA not much less so, these two gain their notability not from their existence but from their peculiar importance in the formation of the careers of future ministers, and their contributions to political debate within the Conservative Party generally. It's not immediately obvious that this is the case here. At present this article appears to describe just one of a great many student societies, and certainly doesn't present any particular reason why this organisation is notable. Attracting minor journalists to speak is no great claim to notability, and Wikipedia is not the place for club or society announcements, or lists of club officers. I feel this article needs substantial improvement if it is to be taken seriously. Edinburgh University has produced many great political figures, so there may be scope for improvement. Let's give this a few days to see what they can come up with before making a recommendation. RomanSpa (talk) 09:40, 12 June 2014 (UTC)

Well the Association is the second oldest conservative Association in the UK, OUCA & CUCA were formed over 50 years after EUCUA. EUCUA forms part of the Scottish Conservatives - and their policy creation is separate from English Conservatives. EUCUA's Port & Policy events' outcomes are put back into the Scottish Conservatives so they do have an input. I wouldn't say Peter Hitchens is a minor journalist myself, but there have been many events with MSPs &c., but I haven't got access to the records at present so can't put in a full list of notable alumni - although I've added a few. I'll keep adding but it's going to take a few days for it to be full. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.168.172.113 (talk) 20:17, 12 June 2014 (UTC)
 * You're probably confusing him with his more significant brother. Notable former members will help a bit, but what we also need is evidence that EUCUA is notable in and of itself - references to the organisation itself in newspapers, journals, magazines and books, where EUCUA is mentioned as significant in its own right. Good luck! RomanSpa (talk) 04:50, 13 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Remember that even negative references will help. Remember that hatchet-job the BBC did on OUCA and CUCA a few years ago? Has anyone ever done anything similar on EUCUA? I vaguely recall that the ill-fated FCS was strongly influenced by students from Scotland: perhaps some useful stuff can be found in press coverage from that time. RomanSpa (talk) 04:54, 13 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Scotland-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 23:22, 12 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Organizations-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 23:22, 12 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Politics-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 23:22, 12 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Schools-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 23:22, 12 June 2014 (UTC)

No, I know of his brother as well but Peter Hitchens is well known as well. There are several negative references in the media about them alone so I'll add them later today. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.168.172.113 (talk) 09:09, 13 June 2014 (UTC)
 * We don't need references to either Hitchens brother, as those would go towards proving their notability, but would say nothing about EUCUA. Negative references to EUCUA, however, will be fine. If you can find half a dozen nasty remarks from the New Statesman, The Morning Star and the Manchester Guardian about EUCUA, complaining that you have excess influence on Conservative Party policy formation, that would be excellent! RomanSpa (talk) 10:47, 13 June 2014 (UTC)

Yes, I meant there are several negative references about EUCUA so will add them, not references about the Hitchens duo. Apologies for the confusion. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.168.172.113 (talk • contribs) 21:24, 13 June 2014

I've added the appearances of EUCUA in the main press that I know of. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 193.109.199.10 (talk) 22:09, 14 June 2014 (UTC)
 * A bot got at your additions, but I've recovered those that were useful and appropriate. Unfortunately, having a badly-behaved club officer mentioned in a newspaper contributes nothing to the club's notability, only to his own. The McCain-Palin endorsement is good, though. RomanSpa (talk) 03:57, 15 June 2014 (UTC)


 * Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.


 * Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, -- RoySmith (talk) 12:11, 19 June 2014 (UTC)


 * Delete and redirect to University of Edinburgh. Ahecht. SW3 5DL (talk) 16:17, 19 June 2014 (UTC)

I've done more than enough to prove the worth of this page, it is more notable than other pages on this site. It clearly deserves to remain. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.157.204.98 (talk) 12:34, 21 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Delete and redirect to University of Edinburgh as failing WP:ORG lacking significant coverage in reliable, independent secondary sources. This is a routine university society with nothing about its activities that are notable. The Whispering Wind (talk) 21:42, 21 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Delete and redirect. I'm a little surprised and disappointed to find myself recommending this course, but, although we've given the article plenty of time to improve its case for notability, this has not been done. Most of what has been described is routine stuff for any political society. Debates, meetings with politicians, the occasional outrageous statement, and assorted drunken antics (now deleted) are pretty much par for the course, and certainly don't create notability. Certainly the society has produced its share of members who have gone on to be MPs, but that's not notable: what would be notable would be if it could be shown that the society yields a disproportionate number of future MPs. This can clearly be shown for OUCA, but doesn't seem to be the case here. The club's achievements seem to be exactly in line with what you'd expect for a student society. There's a certain amount of "scraping the bottom of the barrel", if one of the society's claims to fame is that it once wrote a letter to Queen Victoria wishing her a happy birthday: I suspect such loyal wishes were regularly sent to the then-Queen by a great many clubs and societies. If at some future date a better case can be made for this group's notability, it will be possible to re-create this article, but for now I think it has to go. RomanSpa (talk) 03:40, 22 June 2014 (UTC)
 * (The one entertaining thing I have learnt from all this is that young Conservatives north of the border seem to enjoy referring to themselves as members of the "Scottish Conservative and Unionist Party", gently glossing over the fact that the "Unionist" component of the party's name had nothing to do with Scotland.) RomanSpa (talk) 03:45, 22 June 2014 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.