Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Elizabeth Stratford


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was Merge to Arundel Cathedral.--Ymblanter (talk) 07:23, 28 May 2013 (UTC)

Elizabeth Stratford

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This was previously CSDed as a copyvio, but some of the wording has been changed. I would suggest a redirect to Arundel Cathedral, since I cannot find any sources that mention her at all except her own website and her biography on the cathedral website. Fails WP:NMUSIC and the WP:GNG. Gilderien Chat&#124;List of good deeds 14:01, 6 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Bands and musicians-related deletion discussions.  czar   &middot;   &middot;  14:25, 6 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of England-related deletion discussions.  czar   &middot;   &middot;  14:25, 6 May 2013 (UTC)


 * Delete. Agree with nom, but even the redirect would not seem worthwhile.Truth or consequences-2 (talk) 15:28, 6 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Redirect To Arundel Cathedral. I agree that this fails WP:GNG and WP:MUSICBIO, but the redirect is plausible and valid, and a blurb can be added to the cathedral article. § FreeRangeFrog croak 17:51, 7 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Keep as a 'first' - "first woman to be appointed to the senior music post at an English cathedral". Bearian (talk) 17:16, 13 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Comment that is not cited but in any case it seems rather non-descriptive and non-specific - what counts as senior? And what counts as music? Head of the Choir? Head of Music? Organist? -- Gilderien Chat&#124;List of good deeds 18:05, 13 May 2013 (UTC)

Senior in this case means Director of Music, not Assistant Director of Music, surely? Read Sarah Baldock's page. Senior post. It means the person in charge. Church music terminology generally dictates that the primary function of the Director of Music or Organist and Master of the Choristers is training the choir but actually the role also assumes responsibility for all other aspects of music running in the workplace. So her role at Arundel is to oversee all the music taking place in the building for all services, like you'd expect the Director of Music at Westminster Abbey to do? I still feel there is huge prejudice against this entry without cause. Salicus (talk) 00:05, 23 May 2013 (UTC) 
 * Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.


 * Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, czar   &middot;   &middot;  23:45, 13 May 2013 (UTC)

 
 * Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.


 * Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Mediran ( t  •  c ) 00:16, 20 May 2013 (UTC)


 * Merge with Arundel Cathedral to preserve notable information. Uberaccount (talk) 03:02, 20 May 2013 (UTC)
 * I could go along with that. Bearian (talk) 18:39, 21 May 2013 (UTC)


 * Merge per Uberaccount -- Arundel is a Catholic cathedral; most of these enjoy little more prestige than parish churches. This contrasts with Anglican cathedrals, but even for them, the director of music would need to achieve soemthing more to merit notability.  Peterkingiron (talk) 15:05, 22 May 2013 (UTC)

Very unfair comment as regards the prestige of Catholic Cathedrals. Have you visited Arundel? It isn't a debate about the Cathedral or the prestige thereof, it relates to notability and a number of Anglican directors of music are on Wikipedia without being anything more than Anglican directors of music. You run the risk of exhibiting prejudices against the same set up in the Roman Catholic Church just because it is Roman Catholic. Salicus (talk) 00:05, 23 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Comment By definition a cathedral is the site of a Bishop's seat, equally in both the RC and the Church of England. It is therefore intrinsically of more importance than a parish church, in both the RC and CoE. This particular one is the replacement of a pre-Reformation cathedral, and is itself a grade I listed building.I do not see howe anyone could say it is of secondary importance. That of course doesn't prove the notability of its director of music.  DGG ( talk ) 16:36, 26 May 2013 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.