Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Elliott Morris


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   keep. v/r - TP 13:59, 11 September 2011 (UTC)

Elliott Morris
AfDs for this article: 
 * – ( View AfD View log )

Article on a non-notable young guitarist whose works are self-issued. Page has been vandalized since being created.  Cullen 328  Let's discuss it  01:00, 27 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Keep Profiled by the BBC in 2008 and 2010--from what I'm gathering, you can't get much more notable than that. Blueboy96 01:54, 27 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Reply Two profiles in the same source doesn't count as multiple independent sources.  Cullen 328  Let's discuss it  03:02, 27 August 2011 (UTC)


 * Keep Has appeared at a notable event, the Cambridge Folk Festival; The Northern Sky Online Music Mag would appear to satisfy WP:RS for folk music subculture; notable folk musicians and folk events may often have relatively small audiences, as per article Cafe church. Also, top ratings on iTunes would appear to be a significant source of public recognition among younger people. Morris is featured in the article about the guitar builder Martin Harrison and demo videos by Cort Guitars, with considerable praise, because he "Has established a tradition or school in a particular genre," as per the criteria "For composers and performers outside mass media traditions." WP:COMPOSER Trilliumz (talk) 03:43, 27 August 2011 (UTC)
 * The article about the guitar maker has exactly one sentence about Elliott Morris. It's really a stretch to claim that he was "featured" in that article.  It is a passing mention and not significant coverage.  The guitar company demo videos are promotional in nature and do not constitute a reliable source to establish notability.  To claim that he has "established a tradition or school in a particular genre," as per the criteria "For composers and performers outside mass media traditions" would require a citation to a reliable source that says that, and its a stretch to point to BBC coverage and then go on to claim that he is a performer "outside mass media traditions."  That language in intended to refer to performers active before the time of recorded music, or those active in aboriginal cultures.

 Cullen 328  Let's discuss it  20:48, 28 August 2011 (UTC)
 * As for the Northern Sky Music Magazine, it is a self-published blog by a fellow named Allan Wilkinson. Its a nice, informative blog but it is not a reliable source of the sort that establishes notability on Wikipedia. As for his appearance at a notable folk festival, please be aware that notability is not inherited.  Cullen 328   Let's discuss it  20:58, 28 August 2011 (UTC)
 * My interpretation on "mass media traditions" includes "non-commercial genres" like folk music; not sure why a blog couldn't be a legitimate source for folk performers. The American Folklife Center of the Library of Congress calls its folk concerts the Homegrown Concert Series, indicating that DIY is a legitimate part of certain genres of music. Regarding notability purely as a singer-songwriter, then I'd agree with your interpretation, he's not that far along in his career yet. My take on this performer is that there's a strong case for notability because he's breaking some new ground for the folk fingerstyle guitar. Sure hope we're not holding folk genre musicians to commercial music criteria! Trilliumz (talk) 01:13, 29 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Comment Please, let's get real and take a look at the many articles listed under Category:Folk music and its several subcategories.  Reliable sources have covered folk music in great detail since long before I was born, and I am 59 years old.  A musician doesn't get a free pass from our notability requirements just because that musician claims to be part of the folk music tradition.  Wikipedia has many, many article about notable folk musicians.  We shouldn't keep articles about not-yet-notable musicians just because they claim to be a part of the folk music genre.  Cullen 328   Let's discuss it  04:09, 11 September 2011 (UTC)


 * Keep In addition to the BBC he was also covered at http://thelinc.co.uk/2009/05/spotlight-elliott-morris/  D r e a m Focus  05:00, 27 August 2011 (UTC)
 * TheLinc describes itself as "Lincoln's premier student publication", and as such is not a reliable, independent source to establish notability of a musician associated with that campus community. In addition, the item has a two sentence lead, and the remainder is an interview of the musician.  Accordingly, it is not significant coverage.  Cullen 328   Let's discuss it  20:39, 28 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Student newspaper coverage is not irrelevant, though. He is not reported to be a student at the school, he is local to the area.--Milowent • talkblp-r  19:45, 7 September 2011 (UTC)
 * Above cite states "most prominent of the local scene of a city," as per WP:MUSICBIO. Trilliumz (talk) 18:54, 28 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Bands and musicians-related deletion discussions.  —Philosopher Let us reason together. 21:52, 27 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of England-related deletion discussions.  —Philosopher Let us reason together. 21:52, 27 August 2011 (UTC)


 * KEEP How about Virgin?! That is quite a notable page! http://www.virgin.com/music/reviews/summer-sundae-weekender — Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.147.11.163 (talk • contribs)


 * Delete - Insufficient coverage in reliable sources to establish notability. No prejudice to recreation as it appears that he may become more notable in the future. -- Whpq (talk) 16:53, 29 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.


 * Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Cerejota (talk) 07:12, 4 September 2011 (UTC)


 * Keep: I added some additional sourcing as well .  He is beyond a run of the mill singer-songwriter article (that we do see frequently created, so I do have sympathy for new page patrollers) based on the extensive coverage from BBC and other British media.--Milowent • talkblp-r  19:39, 7 September 2011 (UTC)
 * Keep: I see no need why this artical should be deleted, it could use a few more sources but those could be easily found– Phoenix B 1of3 (talk) 03:14, 11 September 2011 (UTC)
 * Response If those additional sources could be so "easily found", then would you please find them, Phoenix B lof3, and add those references to the article? If you do so, then I will withdraw this nomination.  So far, though, all I see is sparse coverage of an up-and-coming and promising young musician who may deserve coverage on Wikipedia in the future, but hasn't yet crossed over the notability hurdle.  Larding the article up with references that don't meet our requirements for reliable sources is not good enough.  My recommendation to delete this article does not mean that I will oppose in the future if and when the coverage in truly reliable sources is more abundant. I wish this musician and his fans well.   Cullen <sup style="color:purple;">328   Let's discuss it  04:00, 11 September 2011 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.