Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Emil Kazaz


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was no consensus, defaulting to keep. No consensus reached after more than a month of discussion, and there seems little prospect of this changing by extending it. Michig (talk) 18:19, 17 November 2012 (UTC)

Emil Kazaz

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I don't think this sculptor passes WP:BASIC or WP:CREATIVE. I couldn't find any good sources online, and I'm not convinced about the sources in the article. The Asbarez article has good coverage, but I don't think it is enough to support notability by itself. I couldn't find the LA Times piece referenced in the article, but from its title and the mention in the article I am doubtful that it contains significant coverage of Kazaz. — Mr. Stradivarius  (have a chat) 09:42, 14 October 2012 (UTC)
 * Comment I located an additional reference, which indicates the subject won an award at the Florence Biennale (though see Florence_Biennale). That article (whose access needs Highbeam) does also contain 3rd party discussion of the subject's work, possibly from the award citation. AllyD (talk) 10:03, 14 October 2012 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Visual arts-related deletion discussions. AllyD (talk) 10:05, 14 October 2012 (UTC)


 * Comment I found the link to LA Times Article: http://articles.latimes.com/1999/jan/01/local/me-59540. Also here is a link discussing his "William Saroyan" Medal award and contribution to the Armenian identity: http://www.mindiaspora.am/en/News/1654. Here is a link discussing his notability: http://agbu.org/pressoffice/article.asp?ID=663. Also, he won two other awards for sculpture at Florence Biennale, 2007, and 2009: http://www.florencebiennale.org/en/epremiati07.php. Another link associated with his St. Sahag and Mesrob Medal award: http://www.armenianchurchwd.com/news/tribute-to-emil-kazaz/. I hope this establishes enough notability for this sculptor. I originally wrote this information but it was deleted because I did not know how to cite them according to wikipedia reference coding. I hope this helps. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Amuradyan12 (talk • contribs) 10:42, 14 October 2012 (UTC)


 * Comment These links are helpful. All the same, other editors ought to be aware that Amuradyan12 has variously claimed to be a gallery owner and the artist's representative, and a student , depending on the situation, and has edited previously in AFDs and at biographies of Armenian artists using several accounts , . WP:COI and WP:MULTIPLE are obvious concerns. 76.248.149.47 (talk) 15:45, 14 October 2012 (UTC)


 * Comment To make this absolutely clear to everyone, I am a gallery director, not owner. There are multiple galleries in the Los Angeles area and in Armenia who represent this particular artist. This artists artwork is also located in the Museum of Contemporary Art in Armenia. He is a culturally recognized person. As of right now there is almost no information of which I have written on his biography. So there is no biased information whatsover. I have provided multiple links above that are credible from churches, schools, government awards that establish his notability. If anyone would like to write the informatin themselves, please free to do so. Because, I know if I write anything neutral and reference the articles I will get attacked for them. So, please if anyone wishes to write anything about this artist themselves feel free to do so. Because I will not. Thank you. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.93.69.4 (talk) 21:04, 14 October 2012 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of People-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 14:30, 15 October 2012 (UTC)


 * Keep. This article (PanARMENIAN.Net) suggests that Mr Kazaz is a well known and awarded artist in his country. The coverage in Asbarez and some of the sources presented above are sufficient to write a decent article about him. Vejvančický (talk | contribs) 15:18, 15 October 2012 (UTC)


 * Comment Is it safe to take out that deletion note from the top? Also there is a note for more references, is this necessary considering that there are only a few sentences in the article and each one is itself referenced? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Amuradyan12 (talk • contribs) 20:04, 19 October 2012 (UTC)
 * No, don't remove the deletion notice. Deletion discussions usually last for seven days, after which an uninvolved editor will assess the consensus reached by the discussion. I will remove the notice about references as it seems that everything is sourced. Phil Bridger (talk) 20:33, 19 October 2012 (UTC)


 * Delete for lack of significant coverage under WP:GNG and WP:BASIC and other guidelines. I'll examine the sources offered and then do my own search. The L.A. Times article cited above is about a group show, with two paragraphs at the end devoted to Kazaz: "One of the most striking pieces in this sprawling show is Emil Kazaz's "Hang Horse," an enigmatic convergence of loose, gangly lines and forms. Fragmented equestrian imagery struggles to take shape in an image that appears unfinished and vaguely surreal. Here, we think less about the medium than about the curious sum effect, as we should." This is not significant coverage, but it's also not coverage at all of the artist himself; it focuses exclusively on his work. This article is the best argument by far that he's had significant coverage, but it is a short piece that in itself is not sufficient to establish significant coverage, in my view. This source is not properly independent because it is the website of a ministry that promotes the Armenian diaspora, of which Kazaz is a member. In any event, the mention is in passing: "Hakobyan visited famous Armenina painter, sculptor Emil Kazaz with the accompaniment of Consul General Grigor Hovhannisyan and awarded him the “William Saroyan” Medal of the RA Ministry of Diaspora". This page has the same kinds of issues: it's an organization that promotes Armenian heritage, and thus is not entirely independent and reliable. The Florence Biennial awards are not significant awards in the world of art, I think we can agree, and in any event this page is merely a listing of awards and goes into no depth about the artist. This Armenian church website does not cover him in much depth and has the same kinds of independence and reliability issues as some of the other sources, given that he's a member of said church. This "article" is of questionable reliability; it's a press release, not independent coverage. A further search for sources turns up his own website, which is not reliable for notability, the website of a gallery that represents him, also not suitably independent, and various other trivial and routine coverage. All in all, I don't think we've established that he has received significant coverage in reliable sources independent of the subject, as required under WP:GNG. --Batard0 (talk) 05:30, 23 October 2012 (UTC)
 * Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.


 * Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks,  MBisanz  talk 20:19, 24 October 2012 (UTC)

 
 * Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.


 * Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks,  MBisanz  talk 00:04, 1 November 2012 (UTC)




 * Comment This discussion has been going on for three weeks. When will a decision be made? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.93.69.4 (talk) 03:42, 9 November 2012 (UTC)


 * Weak keep. A borderline case. Batard0 makes a good case that we don't have substantial coverage in reliable sources, but says that he's won the Khorenatsi medal, "the Republic of Armenia's highest cultural award", so that ought to support at least an article with the biographical facts for which we can rely on primary sources.   Sandstein   08:48, 9 November 2012 (UTC)
 * Delete - Las Vegas Review-Journal August 31, 1997 mentions an Emil Kazaz. Los Angeles Times January 1, 1999 mentions Emil Kazaz's "Hang Horse". Not enough for a stand alone article. Batard0 cites more sources, but still does not seem to be enough. I suggest taking all these sources, add the infrmation from them to a draft article, and request that the draft be moved to article space at WP:DRV or try WP:AFC. -- Uzma Gamal (talk) 15:23, 9 November 2012 (UTC)
 * Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.


 * Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks,  MBisanz  talk 00:36, 10 November 2012 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.