Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/First Baptist Church (Panama City, FL)


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   no consensus. Stifle (talk) 17:50, 27 July 2013 (UTC)

First Baptist Church (Panama City, FL)

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Sources are all primary or passing mention. No assertation of notability. Ten Pound Hammer • (What did I screw up now?) 03:44, 9 July 2013 (UTC)
 * First Baptist Church is one of Panama City's most prominent and historical foundations, as I am ready to prove. I have the resources to add more secondary and primary resources alike.Carwile2 (talk) 17:07, 9 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Then please do, as otherwise your comment is simply arguing that WP:ITSNOTABLE. - The Bushranger One ping only 21:24, 9 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Florida-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 17:29, 9 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Organizations-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 17:29, 9 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Christianity-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 17:29, 9 July 2013 (UTC)


 * Weak delete There's centennial book that was published on the church's history, a $20 million church building was recently complete, there was a murder and some other news coverage but I don't see anything substantial enough or significant enough to warrant inclusion. Architectural history? Social significance? Maybe it can be merged to a broader subject and covered there? Candleabracadabra (talk) 23:29, 9 July 2013 (UTC)
 * There are some things that I forgot, but can mention: there is social significance, because it seems that things happen there all the time! They have had a Veggie Tales Live! show this past March, as well as other numerous guests and shows, including the Annie Moses Band. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Carwile2 (talk • contribs)
 * None of which is an assertation of notability. Ten Pound Hammer • (What did I screw up now?) 03:39, 10 July 2013 (UTC)


 * Keep; It's the largest organization in Panama City. It's existed more than 100 years, and is on the list for the largest churches of the Southern Baptist Convention. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Carwile2 (talk • contribs) 13:52, 10 July 2013‎ (UTC)
 * Can you provide a source establishing that information? Candleabracadabra (talk) 14:45, 10 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Yes, here (Pg 93), and here. Carwile2 (talk) 23:23, 10 July 2013 (UTC)


 * Keep. Coverage in news and in a history of the town. -- 202.124.74.2 (talk) 15:48, 10 July 2013 (UTC)
 * But will someone please tell the author how to do book citations. -- 202.124.74.2 (talk) 15:50, 10 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Yes, I do admit that I have really only focused on web references, but I will learn and cite it correctly, if someone else doesn't cite it first.Carwile2 (talk) 15:56, 10 July 2013 (UTC)
 * See WP:CITE, or check out what other articles do. -- 202.124.75.19 (talk) 00:16, 11 July 2013 (UTC)


 * Keep. I forgot to mention, the church is so prominent, it has its own television ministry. The program occurs 4-5 times a week on the major cable providers, and once every Sunday on satellite TV. . I will make note to add that to the article soon. Carwile2 (talk) 14:52, 12 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Still a primary source, and don't vote twice. Ten Pound Hammer • (What did I screw up now?) 15:36, 12 July 2013 (UTC)
 * It may be a primary, but it does assert notability. Besides, I can prove it with a secondary alternative Carwile2 (talk) 18:16, 12 July 2013 (UTC)


 * Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.


 * Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Mark Arsten (talk) 17:28, 18 July 2013 (UTC)

 Here are a few sources on my subject which establish notability in response to The Bushranger:
 * http://www.city-data.com/city/Panama-City-Florida.html
 * http://thomrainer.com/2013/01/26/largest-churches-in-the-southern-baptist-convention/
 * http://panamaed.wordpress.com/
 * "And Twelve Came Forward", a Centennial History: First Baptist Church Panama City, Florida 1908-2008
 * "Images of America: Panama City". Glenda A Walker Carwile2 (talk) 17:14, 19 July 2013 (UTC)
 * The City Data site and a Wordpress blog are not reliable sources. The book from the church itself is a Primary source. Try again. Ten Pound Hammer • (What did I screw up now?) 00:41, 19 July 2013 (UTC)
 * I have a few points to redirect to your response:


 * Explain to me how the City Data site is "not reliable". As for the blog, I do agree that there is no way of charting reliability, but it does assert notability (although it may not matter at this point).
 * Your original statement is incorrect now: "Sources are all primary or passing mention. No assertation of notability."
 * "Sources are all primary..." : There are references in my article that are secondary
 * "...or passing mention." : I do believe that a whole bunch of the history section was based on Glenda A. Walter's book.
 * "No assertion of notability." : This discussion has brought forth evidence of notability.
 * Does the prosecution wish to redirect? Carwile2 (talk) 17:14, 19 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Read WP:RS. A personal blog on Wordpress is never reliable. Ten Pound Hammer • (What did I screw up now?) 00:58, 23 July 2013 (UTC)


 * Weak delete but keeping an open mind. Not a notable historical site and I'm not convinced of historical notability otherwise.  This tool] will create proper citations for Google Books sources.  The easier it is for people to find your sources, the easier it is to convince them this institution is notable.  Gamaliel  ( talk ) 23:01, 22 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Although the Wordpress blog is not reliable, my proof that the statement for deletion is irrelevant still stands without the source. As for Gamaliel, thank you for your tool for book sources. I may have to send an email to the Bay County library, so that they may settle this issue once and for all by determining historic significance. I will send them one very soon, and get back when I get a reply. Carwile2 (talk) 01:41, 23 July 2013 (UTC)
 * I am still conversing with the Bay County Library, but if you are not convinced of historical or architectural significance, feel free to browse the Church and Church Building catalogs here Carwile2 (talk) 02:08, 24 July 2013 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.