Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Ford Ivey


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was merge to NERO International. Selectively, but how much is up to editors (a few paragraphs or a few sentences...).  Sandstein  09:19, 8 August 2022 (UTC)

Ford Ivey

 * – ( View AfD View log | edits since nomination)

Article fails WP:GNG and WP:BIO. None of the sources in the article are independent reliable sources that devote significant coverage to the article's subject. I did a thorough WP:BEFORE and there were a few trivial mentions in Google Books and a few articles describing the legal ownership of NERO, I could find nothing that would support notability for the subject. As for the sources in the article, not a single one supports notability:


 * An obituary - Given that obituaries are typically written by surviving family members, it is not an independent source.


 * This NEROtics interview is made by NERO, which is associated with Ivey. Not an independent source.


 * This source is behind a paywall but I was able to find it on Newspapers.com and made a clipping of it here and continued here. Ivey is mentioned in the second link and quotes him but the article is about NERO and the mention of him is trivial coverage. It does take two sentence to describe him briefly, but it is still trivial coverage, mentioned in passing.


 * This biography of him is from "the LARPy awards" from when he was one of their judges. Not an independent source.


 * This NEROtics interview is another NERO paper which is associated with Ivey. Not an independent source.


 * This Philiadephia Inquirer article is reliable but trivial. It's about NERO and literally the only thing it says about Ivey is "Started in 1988 by Ford Ivey in Boston, Mass..." trivial coverage.


 * Images from first NERO event is from NERO and thus not independent, but also is just a collection of images, nothing useful can be sourced from this.


 * Dragon Magazine has an article about NERO on page 46 but doesn't mention Ivey in any way, even in passing.


 * Ravenholt Timeline and History is a NERO page and thus not independent, but also doesn't mention Ivey in any way, even in passing.


 * Who's who in NERO is from NERO itself and thus not independent, but also is just lists his name and title and is trivial coverage.


 * LARPHack is a blog, but reliability of the source aside it's still a trivial mention and all it says about Ivey is "Lead by Ford Ivey, the progenitor and current holder of the NERO Trademark..." the article is about NERO, not Ivey in any way. Trivial coverage.


 * Osiris Sanction is a site for a game created by Ivey. Not an independent source and even in that context only mentions him in passing. Trivial coverage.


 * Legacy Game Systems - Our team is a source listing him as the founder of Legacy Game Systems, making it a non-independent source.

The article seems to be going for an WP:INHERITED notability from NERO, but as notability is not inherited, founding NERO does not make him notable just because NERO itself is notable. Aoidh (talk) 08:20, 31 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Games and Hawaii.  Spiderone (Talk to Spider) 09:28, 31 July 2022 (UTC)


 * Merge to NERO International where the subject is mentioned, I can imagine a section on "Members of note" or such. Will need of course abbreviation. WP:NBIO is not met, rule of thumb - no indepenent source names him in their heading, WP:SIGCOV is not met. Overall, much of the article is cobbled from mentions in passing, with WP:OR being an issue. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 09:36, 31 July 2022 (UTC)
 * The issue I have with merging or creating such a section in the NERO article is that when you take WP:BALANCING into consideration, anything above a passing mention (which already exists in the article, and is all that exists in reliable sources) is undue and disproportionate to coverage by reliable sources. There's really nothing worth merging that would be proportionate to what reliable sources cover, and expanding such a section in the NERO article would place undue emphasis on an aspect of NERO that reliable sources barely mention, when they do mention it at all. - Aoidh (talk) 03:31, 3 August 2022 (UTC)
 * It could always just be redirected then, rather than full deletion. That way, if sources turn up in the future, it can be restored and improved. BOZ (talk) 10:25, 3 August 2022 (UTC)


 * mergeAs I'm reading the timeline, NEROtics started well after Ivey was out of NERO. I'd say that's independent enough and a source of detailed information. The obit is enough to write the basics and the brief mentions are enough to justify a paragraph on him in the main article.  But yeah, doesn't reach WP:N no matter how hard I try... Hobit (talk) 14:19, 3 August 2022 (UTC)
 * Even if a magazine for a game was independent of the person who made the game (in no way is that in any way independent by any definition, the only reason he was featured was because he founded the game, which is a strong connection thus per WP:GNG not independent) both of those are still interviews. Being an interview with Ford Ivey means it’s not independent of Ford Ivey; being that the NERO publication interviewed the founder of NERO specifically because he founded NERO means it’s also not independent, but even if it were the BBC and had no connection, the interview aspect still means it’s not independent. There's nothing to merge. - Aoidh (talk) 18:18, 3 August 2022 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.