Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/France at major beauty pageants


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. I manually removed India, Indonesia, and Philippines for which there is no consensus to delete, I am deleting the rest. I will be happy to recreate individual articles on case-by-case basis, though. Tone 08:48, 20 August 2021 (UTC)

France at major beauty pageants

 * – ( View AfD View log )



At the advice of at Articles for deletion/Denmark at major beauty pageants, there is no real point in nominating these articles in batches anymore — the contents are pretty much identical (side-by-side presentation of data on participants at the Big Four international beauty pageants, even with identical formatting and all) consensus is pretty much rock solid for deleting them as WP:IINFO and WP:SYNTH, and due to the User:Asartea/Pageants AFD, 129 countries and territories will be covered by G4 should they get recreated. So goes 88 more articles as presented here. Big WP:AWBREQ excercise coming up. –LaundryPizza03 ( d c̄ ) 06:02, 13 August 2021 (UTC)


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 * EDIT: Adding the following 3 articles and their delsorts:

–<b style="color:#77b">Laundry</b><b style="color:#fb0">Pizza</b><b style="color:#b00">03</b> ( d c̄ ) 06:33, 13 August 2021 (UTC)
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 * Delete all of them. These are not articles in the sense that a human being wrote them: they could perfectly well be "written" by a computer program, and maybe they were.  Athel cb (talk) 06:54, 13 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Neutral comment A good number of these articles were human-written years ago, then had this ghastly grid pasted onto them. It may be best to look at each one individually to see if they worked in a previous form rather then yet another kitchen-sink pageant nom like this. It really feels like we have a hostility to them that's been over-trebled by a minority of editors who could do better to fix things and help editors rather than continuing to micro-manage WP:PAGEANTS (and a note to noms; start notifying that project of pageant-related deletion discussions. I don't care about its semi-active state. It's the proper and polite thing to do. I'll do it this time, but just del-sorting is not enough).  Nate  • ( chatter ) 08:14, 13 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Comment. If by "ghastly grid" you mean the table of years and competitors, it was already there on 1st April 2014 when the France page was created. It may be worth noting the editor who created it is now blocked indefinitely for suspected sockpuppetry. The same editor created a great many other beauty-related articles, such as Miss Honduras.  Athel cb (talk) 08:35, 13 August 2021 (UTC)


 * You forgot to put the AFD notice on these "87 more articles".  D r e a m Focus  12:34, 13 August 2021 (UTC) fixed
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 * Delete all, not encyclopedic.--Hippeus (talk) 13:34, 13 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete all per WP:NOTSTATS and WP:FANCRUFT; since that is exactly what those pages are. Also Not really relevant since WP:DINC, but nvm ; urgh; some people just have no taste at all as far as aesthetics are concerned... RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 15:19, 13 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Comment The sheer amount of data is striking, should be an external database or private wiki. Unfortunate, someone(s) put a lot of effort into it. Would like to see the pages recoverable should anyone in the future choose to move it elsewhere. -- Green  C  15:36, 13 August 2021 (UTC)
 * The user doing this was blocked for sockpuppets. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Sockpuppet_investigations/Mrdhimas/Archive Anyone can use https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Export and https://list.fandom.com/wiki/Special:Import  D r e a m Focus  17:02, 13 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Just did it. Everything in the category I did port over fast and easy. https://list.fandom.com/wiki/Special:Log/import list them all.   D r e a m Focus  17:06, 13 August 2021 (UTC)
 * delete alll. There is waste of time to handle them individually. If someone wants to undelete any of them individually, citing serious reasons, then let the ball be on their side. Lembit Staan (talk) 19:05, 13 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete - all - as in other Afd.  Onel 5969  <i style="color:blue">TT me</i> 23:12, 13 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete All Per the last AfD and everything stated above. –– 𝗙𝗼𝗿𝗺𝗮𝗹𝗗𝘂𝗱𝗲  talk  19:45, 14 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete all considering the consensus was already well in favour to remove the first few alphabetic bundles. Ajf773 (talk) 00:44, 15 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete all As per nom in their current state as WP:TNT, though If anyone wants to salvage a country or two with proper articles (ex. describe the selection process, or notable events that only concern the country itself), I'd say let them have a go at it. Also noting that Template:Countries at major beauty pageants will need to be TfD as well. Jumpytoo Talk 03:01, 15 August 2021 (UTC
 * Dushan is right in that a few of these articles do have some depth to them. I only initially checked the big western countries and I assumed the rest were similar. I skimmed through every article and these 3 have enough that at least they should be sent individually, if not outright kept:
 * India at Big Four international beauty pageants
 * Indonesia at major beauty pageants
 * Philippines at major beauty pageants
 * There might be a few more that I missed (I only focused on the part above the table), but other than those 3, delete the rest. Jumpytoo Talk 21:19, 16 August 2021 (UTC)

---Richie Campbell (talk) 03:07, 19 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete all per WP:TNT. As people do watch and follow this kind of talent shows, I would not be against a well-balanced and written country series. The current articles, however, are really bad so we're better off with all gone. gidonb (talk) 16:12, 15 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete all. blablabla WP:INDISCRIMINATE blablabla WP:LISTN. JBchrch   talk  21:18, 15 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Comment I don't think we would delete the Indonesia_at_major_beauty_pageants page if it was not part of a mass deletion. The list could be deleted from this article and it would still stand. I only looked at three pages, has anyone looked at all 87, are we deleting pages without looking at them. Don't mistake me for someone who cares, but first they came for the pageant lists and next they will be after earthquake lists, I didn't want to say nothing. Dushan Jugum (talk) 09:47, 16 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete all per WP:NOTSTATS. SBKSPP (talk) 00:56, 17 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete all per WP:INDISCRIMINATE. There is no use of making these kind of article on Wikipedia. Lara (talk) 03:54, 17 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete articles with no in-depth coverage, and Keep the few as per Dushan and Jumpytoo (Indonesia, India, Philippines). Not a pageant fan myself but it would be easy to create an article that would pass WP:GNG in countries where these pageants are taken seriously (e.g. Philippines).Hariboneagle927 (talk) 10:17, 17 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Comment - I agree with the others that have singled out India, Philippines and Indonesia as ones that should not be deleted as part of this AfD. Spiderone (Talk to Spider) 23:13, 18 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Comment - upon reviewing all the articles in question, I concur to Keep India, Philippines and Indonesia; these articles contain third party reliable sources and should not be deleted as part of this AfD.---Richie Campbell (talk) 02:17, 19 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Keep for Philippines at major beauty pageants. Beauty pageants in the Philippines is just like the Olympics or Superbowl according to the articles indicated below. If you only look closely at the article, Philippines at major beauty pageants or search for reliable sources online, you'll find a plethora of third party reliable sources to support and to improve the article. Below are just some examples and you can search for more through google:
 * https://filipinotimes.net/feature/2018/05/21/want-represent-philippines-international-pageants-heres/
 * https://news.abs-cbn.com/life/01/01/20/rewind-the-decade-ph-became-a-major-major-pageant-powerhouse
 * https://www.rappler.com/nation/special-coverage/map-big4-beauty-pageants
 * https://newsinfo.inquirer.net/1370730/second-most-crowned-country-in-international-beauty-pageants
 * https://technology.inquirer.net/109768/these-5-beauties-are-queens-on-tiktok-too
 * https://philnews.ph/2020/12/12/beauty-pageant-ranking-whats-the-philippines-status-in-the-number-of-crowns/
 * https://asiamedia.lmu.edu/2019/02/11/philippines-powerhouse-of-beauty-pageants/
 * https://philstarlife.com/geeky/379114-philippines-international-beauty-pageant-crowns
 * https://www.scmp.com/video/asia/3013113/asias-pageant-powerhouse-why-philippines-obsessed-beauty-queens
 * https://www.ibtimes.com.au/philippines-brazil-venezuela-three-countries-win-big-four-international-beauty-pageants-1318720
 * https://www.channelnewsasia.com/cnainsider/breaking-silence-ugly-truth-beauty-contests-pageants-philippines-719271
 * https://www.goodnewspilipinas.com/big-4-beauty-pageants-filipina-titlists-on-harpers-bazaar-vietnam-magazine-cover/
 * https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-25550425
 * https://www.pep.ph/lifestyle/parenting/144438/these-bb-pilipinas-daughters-are-worthy-of-their-own-crowns
 * https://mb.com.ph/2021/05/22/the-clash-binibining-pilipinas-versus-miss-world-philippines/
 * https://tribune.net.ph/index.php/2019/06/02/pageantry-crowns-the-philippines/
 * https://www.manilatimes.net/2021/05/21/entertainment-lifestyle/show-times/these-5-beauties-are-queens-on-tiktok-too/1803301
 * Keep All and create more similar articles. These articles are basically a list of womens, almost all of whom will qualify for WP:BIO if sufficinet research is done using local media. Having a historic record of people who took part in world wide compitition is useful not only for now, but for future generations. Also these articles will be a good starting point for researchers. Having something is better than nothing. Also respect the authours and their contribution who created those articles.  nirmal (talk) 04:07, 19 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Why do we need to create even more articles that violate WP:NOT? Please can you tell me which Wikipedia inclusion guideline Gibraltar at major beauty pageants meets? Also WP:ITSUSEFUL, WP:SOURCESMAYEXIST and WP:IWORKEDSOHARD are classic examples of arguments to avoid at AfD. It is not Wikipedia's place to be a starting point for researchers, we should only be publishing research that has already been done by established people in the field. Spiderone (Talk to Spider) 08:04, 19 August 2021 (UTC)


 * Keep for India, Philippines and Indonesia per arguments by Richie Campbell et al. above. I concur with Dushan's funny but legitimate concern that pages are arguably being deleted without being reviewed. Therefore, I abstain about the 84 other articles.Koikefan (talk) 08:28, 19 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Keep India, Indonesia and Phillipines, don't know about the rest. ~Styyx Talk? ^-^ 09:43, 19 August 2021 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. <b style="color:red">Please do not modify it.</b> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.