Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Francis Pollara


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   delete. – Juliancolton  &#124; Talk 13:45, 25 October 2009 (UTC)

Francis Pollara

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This filmmaker is still in school, I'm not convinced by the sources that he reaches the bar of notability, and Google News didn't come up with anything any better when I searched his name. The long list of projects he supposedly worked on is mostly a mishmash of redlinks and things he didn't actually have a hand in. Appears to be some puffery going on. Beeblebrox (talk) 19:40, 17 October 2009 (UTC)


 * Delete. Creation of a WP: SPA, not sourced, no reliable sources available. No bias against re-creating in future should source/notablity issues be addressed.  --Whoosit (talk) 19:47, 17 October 2009 (UTC)

I beg to differ. The filmmaker is still in school but his work is without a doubt notable. I am still building this article and would appreciate the time to do so properly but Pollara has a running business made up of students that has been producing professional material. Cybertek Integrated Media a sister company is producing and distributing a feature film "Blood Ghost" in 2009. Currently in pre-production I have not found substantial data on the production. Pollara also has various products that he crafts and sells privately and have been used on various low budget productions like "Table for Three" which is listed on IMDB. I think for a twenty year old cinematographer/producer this is worthy of Wikipedia.

In addition after a google search Pollara's name and credits appear page after page. He has been credited for the Luv Delux music video on over 50 respectable blogs including MTV, Kanye West and artist Alex Pardee. His deigns are most sought after currently in the viral world and I have found some discussion in a web series interview of offers made to him and his partner by various production companies including Caporal Films (located in France), Future Shorts, and Underground Films.

So again with time additions and edits will be made accordingly but this article is valid and should not be opted for deletion. -John
 * One of the very few things on Wikipedia that is not negotiable is that articles must be verified by reliable sources. Blogs generally do not fall into that category. If you are having trouble finding material that meets the definition of reliable sources, that is usually an indication that the subject is not sufficiently notable. That he may be in the future is crystal ball gazing. Beeblebrox (talk) 20:28, 17 October 2009 (UTC)

I am not a SPA user. I am a new user. I created my user account less than 48 hours prior to this message so please do not categorize me with SPA when I clearly have had no time to be involved in any other work. The articles are there, the sources are there I am compiling them into and organized legible fashion. I am not aware of a Wiki requirement stating that the article must be fully complete before posting. Rather if I am not mistaken the idea here is to post truthful and relevant information to involve others to add to informational articles of people both living and not whether in school or not. Maybe I am missing the point but why is my work not eligible while similar pages have been available for years. Most of which are articles people could care less about while mine is substantial.
 * Please Note: I have fixed the mentioned "mishmash" of red links. Please excuse as I am still learning the Wiki formatting. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Johnart111 (talk • contribs) 20:39, 17 October 2009 (UTC)
 * I frankly agree that there are many, many articles that most people would not care about, but as you see here, that is very much in the eye of the beholder. An oft-cited essay at these debates is WP:OTHERCRAPEXISTS which basically refutes that line of reasoning however. While not a policy, it is generally seen as a valid point. You are also correct that articles do not have to be complete and perfect before posting, but they do need reliable sources attached in order to be kept. This debate will run for an entire week, so you have a good amount of time left to address the issues raised here. There is a beginner's guide to properly sourcing your article at WP:REFBEGIN that may be of some use to you. Beeblebrox (talk) 21:08, 17 October 2009 (UTC)

I understand your point and will do my best in the weeks time to add and omit as needed to maintain the status of the article. Thank you for the information regarding Wikipedia formatting etc. In addition I think its great that there are dedicated users that protect the Wikipedia principles otherwise the clutter of useless articles would make Wikipedia as a tool useless for search and research purposes. - John —Preceding unsigned comment added by Johnart111 (talk • contribs) 22:06, 17 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Delete. Not everyone who receives a credit on a notable film is notable. According to Pollara, he is not a film producer on any notable films. He is a production assistant (among other jobs like camera assistant, grip). These jobs don't confer notability under normal circumstances. As noted in the production assistant article, it's basically a $10/hour job, so wikipedia editors shouldn't get the impression that it's akin to being the director or producer. Furthermore, going by the blue links in the filmography is deceptive. If you click on them, almost none of them link to articles about the films that Pollara worked on. Rather they link to disambiguation pages or totally different subjects that share the same name. It appears that the filmography is largely films that weren't notable enough to garner articles (perhaps student/amateur films). His work on notable films (Blades of Glory, Get Smart) are in minor capacities that wouldn't garner notability like starring, directing, producing or even DP or editor would garner. --JamesAM (talk) 00:29, 19 October 2009 (UTC)
 * On that same note, a careful analysis of the references listed shows that several of them do not directly relate to this individual. Beeblebrox (talk) 02:06, 19 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Yes, the reference after the sentence about Affonso Beato doesn't mention Pollara at all. It's just Beato's website. And one link is just apparently the website of a relative. --JamesAM (talk) 23:23, 19 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Just to point out Pollara does seem to be like the average "joe schmo" but this 20 year old did produce the last known "Thriller" recording. Still looking for valid sources but Mr. Jackson and his agent took part in the production as it was created and aired upon the 25th anniversary of the original "Thriller". Now maybe if Mr. Jackson were with us today this would not be as relevant. Not very many young filmmakers achieve such credits without family or close ties to the industry which this person does not have. He is self made and has done a great job. I am continuing to add as I research. Best, -John —Preceding unsigned comment added by 206.117.150.129 (talk) 21:57, 19 October 2009 (UTC)
 * The article says it's a video, not an audio recording. The link after that sentence doesn't mention Pollara at all. Aired where/when? Official/unofficial? Marketed anywhere? --JamesAM (talk) 23:23, 19 October 2009 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.