Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Francisco Rodríguez (Venezuelan economist)


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   speedy keep. I am not convinced, but consensus seems clear. (non-admin closure) Pcap ping  19:10, 17 February 2010 (UTC)

Francisco Rodríguez (Venezuelan economist)

 * – ( View AfD View log  •  )

Seems to fail WP:PROF. Pcap ping  02:34, 17 February 2010 (UTC)


 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Academics and educators-related deletion discussions.  -- Pcap  ping  02:35, 17 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Venezuela-related deletion discussions.  -- Pcap  ping  02:35, 17 February 2010 (UTC)

Keep. You seem to have forgotten he was also a politician, in the Chavez regime. You also may have failed to notice him mentioned in The Financial Times and figuring on multiple media broadcasts, like:
 * http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/latin_america/jan-june07/venezuela_01-15.html
 * http://marketplace.publicradio.org/display/web/2007/04/10/chavez_opponents_left_jobless_blacklisted/
 * http://frrodriguez.web.wesleyan.edu/docs/cv_francisco_rodriguez.pdf (scroll down to television appearances)

You also may have failed to search Spanish-language sources for additional references, for example, easily found dozens at El Universal, such as:
 * http://noticias.eluniversal.com/2006/10/15/pol_art_34964.shtml
 * http://www.eluniversal.com/2000/09/04/eco_art_03201AA.shtml

.. Or google news, for example:
 * http://www.nytimes.com/2007/11/30/business/worldbusiness/30chavez.html?pagewanted=all
 * http://wesleyanargus.com/2010/02/09/rodriguez-brings-un-human-development-report-to-wes%E2%80%A8/
 * http://www.democracynow.org/2007/5/31/chavez_shuts_down_venezuelan_tv_station
 * http://www.democracynow.org/2007/12/17/a_debate_on_hugo_chavez_and

.. Or associations beyond PROF, like:
 * http://www.independent.org/aboutus/person_detail.asp?id=1258
 * http://www.un.org/esa/policy/backgroundpapers/rodriguez_2.pdf
 * Shall I continue? Another silly effort to suppress information not pro-Chavez from Wiki.  Sandy Georgia  (Talk) 07:07, 17 February 2010 (UTC)
 * The version I nominated  did not present him as a politician. But I don't see how he passes WP:POLITICIAN either. He has a few media appearances as an expert on Venezuela. But the mainstream news pieces are not about him. Only the story in a student newspaper is about him. (For comparison purposes David Mertz was interviewed a fair bit too; that didn't prevent deletion of his bio.) Rodríguez does not seem qualify as an outstanding media personality per WP:ENTERTAINER, which applies to serious TV shows as well. Also, please WP:AGF: I've never edited anything related to Chavez, and I don't like the guy either. If this is an attempt to promote his opponents, then WP:SOAP should be a good read. Pcap  ping  07:33, 17 February 2010 (UTC)


 * The version you saw did mention the Venezuelan National Assembly; I have now linked it for you, so you can continue to do your homework. And if you want to start deleting bios of people who don't have mainstream mentions specifically about them beyond their own websites, you've got a lot of deleting to do. Sandy Georgia  (Talk) 07:38, 17 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Excuse my ignorance, but what does "the economist of the Venezuelan National Assembly from 2000 to 2004" mean? Was he an elected member, or just an economic adviser? Pcap ping  08:04, 17 February 2010 (UTC)
 * It's not that simple in Venezuela's version of "democracy" (in other words, I don't know, but few are legitimately elected to anything in Venezuela these days ... it likely means he was chosen by Chavez, but I really don't know, since it seems that the, um, constitution keeps changing in Venezuela). Sandy Georgia (Talk) 08:07, 17 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Did some research. Despite the pompous title "head of the Office of Economic and Financial Advisory of the National Assembly" (can you expect any different from Chavez's blokes?) he was not an Assembly diputado, but a high-level technocrat adviser attached to it. He gets very little coverage on their National Assembly site. He does not have an individual web page like the diputados do (e.g. ). Even Francisco (Kid) Rodriguez, the pitcher, has more coverage on that site . Almost certainly our economist friend wielded no real power. Pcap ping  08:49, 17 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Why do you think the National Assembly or the local controlled media is going to have a page about someone that is critical of Hugo Chavez? Last time I checked, Chavez was trying  to regulate the Internet in the same way he does the local media, attempting to stop any sort of negative commentary about his rule. 1.--Jmundo (talk) 15:21, 17 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Pohta, you may be a bit naive about the control Chavez has over media, the judiciary, and the National Assembly and everything else in Venezuela; most certainly, someone who used to "work" for the Chavez administration, and then opposed them, will not be represented on their websites. That's how it works in Venezuela :)  Sandy Georgia  (Talk) 15:26, 17 February 2010 (UTC)
 * In fact, the Venezuelan Assembly link you added to the article has now gone dead (I wouldn't be surprised if we soon lose El Universal (Caracas), as has happened to most media in Venezuela). Can you check the link you added?  Sandy Georgia  (Talk) 15:40, 17 February 2010 (UTC)


 * Keep: Per the references provided by Sandy. Even if he does not pass PROF, he certainly passes WP:BIO. --Defender of torch (talk) 07:57, 17 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Comment. No opinion on keep or delete yet, but I find Sandy's comment "Another silly effort to suppress information not pro-Chavez from Wiki" directed at the nominator to be distinctly unhelpful. No reason to start throwing personal accusations like that, which appears to imply some sort of bad faith/POV motives behind the nom. At the time of the nomination the article did look like an article about an academic, with a fairly junior title of an assistant professor. It was not unreasonable under those circumstances to AfD the article on the basis of falining WP:PROF and I am sure that the nom acted in good faith. It is not yet clear to me if the subject has independent notability under WP:BIO but in any event let's try to keep the temperature down here. Nsk92 (talk) 15:47, 17 February 2010 (UTC)
 * My apologies to the nominator, who had nothing to do with that comment; the origin of this AFD seems to be here (which is where I may have incorrectly assumed the nominator came up with the incomplete deletion rationale). Sandy Georgia  (Talk) 16:07, 17 February 2010 (UTC)


 * Keep. There is a baseball player with the same name which makes google-searching somewhat difficult. But even a highly filtered GoogleNews search returns 236 hits. Enough here to pass WP:BIO, plus a case could be made for passing criterion 7 of WP:PROF since he is frequently quoted in the media as an expert on Venezuela's politics and economy. Nsk92 (talk) 17:02, 17 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Well, this is probably going to be kept. After having some advisory job in Chavez' legislative body he turned into a Chavez critic and defected to the US (not sure which came first). Reminds me of Vladimir Tismaneanu in his early days. But I don't think Rodríguez raises to notability yet, even as a Chavez critic. For my amusement, a google search for Chávez critic returned a lot stories about other guys: Didalco Bolivar, Manuel Rosales , Raúl Baduel , Mario Vargas Llosa , Teodoro Petkoff , Pat Robertson/Thor Halvorssen , Alejandro Sanz , Ramon Martinez , but not about Rodríguez, or even a story where he criticizes Chavez. The same observation hold for google news archives, but order of hits is not that relevant there. YMMV, of course. Pcap ping  19:10, 17 February 2010 (UTC)


 * On a separate issue, I may have misnamed this article, as I created it while very busy, only to avoid a lengthy discussion of who Rodriguez is in another article. Should it be instead Francisco Rodríguez (economist); I'm unsure? Or is the Venezuelan helpful to distinguish him from the Venezuelan baseball player by the same name ? Sandy Georgia  (Talk) 17:08, 17 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Yes, I think the word "Venezuelan" is redundant and makes the title of the article longer than it needs to be. IMO, having "(economist)" in the title is sufficient for disambiguation purposes, to distinguish him from other people with the same name. However, moving the title can probably wait until after the AfD. Nsk92 (talk) 18:21, 17 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Sound good-- perhaps someone will do the honors if I forget. Sandy Georgia  (Talk) 18:23, 17 February 2010 (UTC)
 * I agree that having Venezuelan in the title is unnecessary. Pcap ping  18:40, 17 February 2010 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.