Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/George Drever


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk, contributions) 17:56, 24 August 2019 (UTC)

George Drever

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Very well written article, but the subject simply doesn't meet WP:GNG, nor does he meet WP:NSOLDIER.  Onel 5969  TT me 16:59, 10 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Military-related deletion discussions.  CASSIOPEIA(talk) 21:04, 10 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Scotland-related deletion discussions.  CASSIOPEIA(talk) 21:04, 10 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of People-related deletion discussions.  J  947 &thinsp;(c) , at 02:30, 11 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Spain-related deletion discussions.  J  947 &thinsp;(c) , at 02:30, 11 August 2019 (UTC)


 * Comment Hello and thank you for your advice, I am still learning! Can the article page just be removed from these categories rather than deleted altogether?  If it is seen as too incomplete can it be moved 'back' into a DRAFT ARTICLE status instead. The notability of Scottish working class volunteers in the Spanish Civil War such as George Drever is referenced elsewhere and others can find more supporting materials, or I can when back in action (but not this coming 7 days however, due to other commitments). Help and advice is much appreciated. Other editors who have advised me can help steer? Kaybeesquared (talk) 14:24, 11 August 2019 (UTC)


 * Comment Added two book citations to the page.  Does this mean deletion can now be postponed? Kaybeesquared (talk) 14:49, 11 August 2019 (UTC)


 * Comment Added two book citations to the page. Does this mean deletion can now be postponed? Kaybeesquared (talk) 15:03, 11 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Hi - As I said on your talk page, don't let this AfD discourage you, you're doing fine work. Rarely do I feel as bad when I nominate a page for deletion as I did when making this one.  It's a very nice article. Let's see what other editors think about the notability of the subject.  My fear is that while there are mentions of him, there isn't the type of in-depth coverage necessary to meet WP:GNG, and he definitely doesn't meet WP:NSOLDIER. The additional citations are fine, but I don't feel that they meet the notability criteria.  However, I am far from infallible, so a I said, let's wait to hear from other editors. Onel 5969  TT me</i> 15:42, 11 August 2019 (UTC)


 * Comment Thank you for your generous teaching - I am not familiar with the edit source language formats yet; so apologies for causing you extra work. Hopefully this comment is correctly drafted.  One of the challenges re 'Scottish working class' notable people who put their life on the line for a cause, is they are to be ignored by rest of the world?  As you say, we have to see what other editors do or say on the matter. I will look for other sources but cannot do more until about three weeks from now due to commitments externally.

Once again thanks for taking time out to assist a newbie!

Kaybeesquared (talk) 17:16, 11 August 2019 (UTC)

<div class="xfd_relist" style="border-top: 1px solid #AAA; border-bottom: 1px solid #AAA; padding: 0px 25px;"> Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Keep the article meets WP:GNG with WP:RSs. The person died prior to the age of the internet, however good coverage from secondary sources exists. Herald Scotland and Scotsman In addition, books also refer to this person. Like: The Scottish Soldier Abroad WP:ATD Wm335td (talk) 20:28, 13 August 2019 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Rollidan (talk) 20:30, 17 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Keep As well as the sources currently in the article (and the creator has added many since it was nominated for AfD), there are contemporary newspaper reports available in the digitised British Newspaper Archive. His talks before and after he fought in Spain are reported (he gave a series of talks in 1934 on "Revolutions or Revolts"), and of course there were reports of him being missing and then being held prisoner, which have biographical information in them too (he was the eldest son, apparently). I will be happy to add them to the article. There are certainly enough sources to meet WP:GNG (and there is also WP:BASIC, which does not appear needed in this case, but says "If the depth of coverage in any given source is not substantial, then multiple independent sources may be combined to demonstrate notability; trivial coverage of a subject by secondary sources may not be sufficient to establish notability.") RebeccaGreen (talk) 22:05, 17 August 2019 (UTC)

However Drever is referenced in various IB materials and quoted by other Scottish Volunteers to the International Brigade in their personal histories, which can be added to the article as supportive evidence.
 * Keep Thank you for the extra resources as I began the article to help us to flush out further materials, because Drever is a notable example of educated working class who contributed to scientific research and also to further philosophical/ethical/political causes such as communism, anti-facism in his case but these people can be ignored by the traditional media, making secondary sources difficult to find.

Kaybeesquared (talk) 15:53, 18 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Keep, the article has enough sources and meets WP:GNG Alex-h (talk) 13:52, 21 August 2019 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. <b style="color:red">Please do not modify it.</b> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.