Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Haider Ali (musician)


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete based on both promotional and notability concerns. Barkeep49 (talk) 00:36, 20 October 2020 (UTC)

Haider Ali (musician)

 * – ( View AfD View log )

I don't believe this individual is notable per Wikipedia criteria in WP:GNG, WP:NBIO, or WP:NARTIST. The citations are to articles about other things which merely mention him as being a part of something, but none discuss him significantly, and I am unable to find such sources from a Google search. ... disco spinster   talk  18:27, 11 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Artists-related deletion discussions. ...  disco spinster   talk  18:27, 11 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Bands and musicians-related deletion discussions. ...  disco spinster   talk  18:27, 11 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Pakistan-related deletion discussions. ...  disco spinster   talk  18:27, 11 October 2020 (UTC)


 * Comment Hi, user: discospinster, I am the original author of the following article. Thank you for raising concerns about the article, I appreciate your efforts in keeping the article on check to make sure it follows all the Wikipedia criteria in WP:GNG, WP:NBIO, or WP:NARTIST. I have done my best to gather as many sources to support the article as I could for the past 11 months or so, however, I welcome anyone to improve the references of the article by adding more relevant sources, and I do believe that the subject belongs to the Wikipedia mainspace as there are several sources that talk about him in detail, for instance, the following article on the Atlantic talks about him and his art in great detail however, I am working on to find more relevant sources for the article as we speak. Thank you! Alexjnoah (talk) 18:45, 11 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete unambiguous promo. Vexations (talk) 14:51, 19 October 2020 (UTC)


 * Delete this is obviously a promotional effort. I trimmed at least a dozen bad sources (Linkedin, Coursera and the like). The Atlantic source is decent but it is a couple of sentences. Based on the included sources, this a GNG fail. ThatMontrealIP (talk) 19:19, 11 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Comment I would beg to differ as I have already stated on the article's talk page, I have no affiliation with subject of the article, nor do I have any biases. I added as many sources as I could find on Google search, and I am in the process of editing the article to improve the sources, however, it needs time, there are already many decent sources cited, and I am looking for more as we speak, and I welcome any of you to help and improve this article, and here is another source that I have just found and now adding to the article, it talks about the subject in detail, and it's from a very reputable news orginaztion in India. Alexjnoah (talk) 19:36, 11 October 2020 (UTC)


 * Please do not try to delete the AFD page again. That does not work.ThatMontrealIP (talk) 20:51, 11 October 2020 (UTC)
 * The above (new) editor has also carefully tried to scrub the article from all AFD sorting lists, and reverted the removals of linkedin etc.ThatMontrealIP (talk) 21:03, 11 October 2020 (UTC)


 * Delete in addition to the important concerns about sourcing from linkedin pages and the like, many of the sources refer to a different subject entirely. (The link in this discussion page, about painting a bus in Durga Puja, refers to a different Haider Ali.) The one that is the subject of this page seems to miss GNG by quite a bit. Bangabandhu (talk) 19:52, 11 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Comment: The person referred to in the Atlantic article is not the same person in this article, it is also Haider Ali (artist). ... disco spinster   talk  05:48, 12 October 2020 (UTC)


 * Keep Hi, thank you for raising the concerns and outlining the issues with this article. I want to take this opportunity to address everything clearly and form the basis for keeping this article in the mainspace and explain with polices as to why the article has a place in the Wiki encyclopedia. I would also like to request the nominator of the deletion of this article and any administrator(s) to form the judgment based on logical reasoning presented before us, and the review process should not be decided solely by head count, but by consensus according to Deletion_policy. Since our discussion several days ago, I have made some important edits, and cleared all the issues raised above, and added half a dozen new relevant sources from major news publications in Pakistan. The irrelevant sources and information confusing the subject of this article with another person have now been removed, and all the discrepancies have been addressed accordingly as well. The LinkedIn sources were used as part of the WP:ABOUTSELF policy under which self-published sources from the subject may be used as sources of information about themselves if the article is not based primarily on such sources which it never was, however, the LinkedIn sources have also been removed now due to being controversial in this WP:AFD debate. Now onto why the subject is of public interest and why the article should be kept, and how it meets the 'notable' per Wikipedia criteria under WP:GNG, WP:NBIO, WP:NARTIST, and specifically WP:MUSIC policies — upon research, I have found that the subject of this article is a member of internationally acclaimed Pakistani pop/rock band, Strings (band), with whom he (the subject) and the rest of the band have sold over 25 million albums worldwide to this day, and have won the following awards for their music performances internationally and in Pakistan Strings_(band) and it meets the criteria set forth under WP:BAND notability policy on all counts. Furthermore, the subject has also been a part of the house band on Coke Studio (Pakistan) — the longest-running annual television music show in Pakistan, running annually since 2008, and the subject joined the show on Coke_Studio_(Pakistani_season_8) in 2015 as a guitarist and keyboardist, and returned for the Coke_Studio_(Pakistani_season_9) in 2016 as a guitarist and Coke_Studio_(Pakistani_season_10) in 2017 as a keyboardist for three consecutive seasons — on the show he has performed alongside one of the biggest names in Pakistan's music industry including: Atif_Aslam, Momina_Mustehsan, Ali_Azmat, his own band Strings (band), and many more. The show is televised and broadcasted on all major Pakistani news/entertainment T.V. channels, and radio stations with new episodes air on weekly basis and reruns air throughout the week, and the show has been viewed in 186 countries across the world Coke_Studio_(Pakistani_TV_program), and the musical performances from the show are easily found on YouTube publicly for anyone to watch, hence, there is no doubt whatsoever whether the subject of this article is 'notable' per Wikipedia criteria WP:GNG, WP:NBIO, WP:NARTIST, and WP:MUSIC policies or not — the subject is being shown on television right now as we speak. It should also be taken into the consideration that the subject's band Strings (music) and its' (several) members have their own separate articles, therefore, the subject should also be included in the Wiki encyclopedia and have his own article as the sources are cited accordingly, and news coverage the subject has received in the media is overwhelming. In conclusion, I believe this article should be kept, and the nomination for the deletion should be withdrawn in light of the new evidence presented above. Thank you! Alexjnoah (talk) 13:35, 17 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete Fails WP:MUSICIAN. Article reads like a resume with the expected overlinking (and absurd amount of external links) in failed attempt to establish notability. No viable third-party coverage, just the usual downloading sites. Some results were about a cricketer of the same name despite including "Music" in Google search. And good luck getting anyone to read that entire wall of text. sixty nine   • whaddya want? •  04:28, 19 October 2020 (UTC)


 * Comment The article satisfies WP:MUSICIAN on significant accounts, the lack of knowledge in this discussion about the subject is not a valid reason for deletion, and the article meets the 'notable' per Wikipedia criteria under WP:GNG, WP:NBIO, WP:NARTIST, and specifically WP:MUSIC policies by a great margin. If the article has had any issues with the way it is written, any editor is free to improve it, that is not a logical reason for deletion, and the article only have a total of two external links just like every article on Wiki encyclopedia. There are at least twenty high quality sources cited in the article that are published by major news outlets in Pakistan, so there should not be a bias whether the news sources are major publications or not, and there is not one downloading site cited as a source in the article, and it is not the subject's fault he has a famous Muslim name, there are many notable people with the same name, therefore, the subject can easily be searched on Google Search by entering "Haider Ali Coke Studio" or "Haider Ali Strings," so it should be taken into consideration that the lack of knowledge about the subject in this discussion does not necessarily mean the subject is lacking notability, and the suggestion that "And good luck getting anyone to read that entire wall of text" sounds quite biased, and violates Articles_for_deletion for using sarcasm, and I believe any and all editors must refrain from such comments, and not be biased one way or the other, and should rather provide sound reasoning and logical arguments using Wiki policies. In conclusion, the article should be kept and the deletion nomination should be withdrawn immediately as per Articles_for_deletion because the discussion has run its' course for a complete 168 hours with no logical consensus reached. Finally, any one is free to improve the article as they see fit using relevant sources. Thank you! Alexjnoah (talk) 09:35, 19 October 2020 (UTC) — Alexjnoah (talk&#32;• contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
 * Actually the tally this far is five d*elete and one k*eep !votes. Please do not try to close this afd or remove deletions sorting notices again as you are WP:INVOLVED. You have done it twice already and it is time consuming to restore things.ThatMontrealIP (talk) 22:04, 19 October 2020 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.