Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Head of the former Chinese imperial clan


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. Seraphimblade Talk to me 16:32, 3 July 2021 (UTC)

Head of the former Chinese imperial clan

 * – ( View AfD View log )

This article is little more than a compilation of various minor figures and events of Chinese history. It lacks a narrative or theme that might turn a collection of details into a coherent story or article. A search of GBooks does not return any examples of the phrase "Head of the former Chinese imperial clan." Emperors sometimes appointed a few members of the previous ruling clan to minor positions. Many of the examples are sourced to primary sources. Has any secondary source considered this matter worth looking into? From looking over the article's references, I don't get the sense that anyone has. 99to99 (talk) 15:27, 6 June 2021 (UTC)
 * This article was translated from Chinese Wikipedia. The Chinese title translates as, "Two crownings, three respects." The theme of the article is that the current emperor is showing his respect to a former ruling clan. This establishes the current dynasty as a legitimate successor of the previous dynasty. According to the opening paragraph, appointments from the Yuan onward were not considered crownings or respects. So later examples could be just people related to a former emperor who got minor appointments. 99to99 (talk) 04:59, 15 June 2021 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of China-related deletion discussions. Shellwood (talk) 13:53, 6 June 2021 (UTC)


 * Automated comment: This AfD was not correctly transcluded to the log (step 3). I have transcluded it to Articles for deletion/Log/2021 June 6.  —cyberbot I   Talk to my owner :Online 14:05, 6 June 2021 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of History-related deletion discussions.  Spiderone (Talk to Spider) 14:43, 6 June 2021 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Split and Repurpose -- Much of the article concerns titles given by emperors to the families of ousted predecessors. That is potentially an article worth having, but not with the current title.  The last section concerns pretneders to the Qing dynasty's imperial crown.  This is an interesting topic, worth a short article.  Peterkingiron (talk) 16:37, 6 June 2021 (UTC)
 * The information on Chinese pretenders also appears at House of Aisin-Gioro. It was originally written for Line of succession to the former Chinese throne. Wikipedia once had nearly fifty "former throne" articles of this type. After a mass deletion, only two remain, both about the French monarchy. Infogalactic still has the old articles. 99to99 (talk) 11:46, 8 June 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete. The ostensible subject of this article is a political institution of imperial china, and that's what the lead suggests. But I can't see it discussed as such in the sources, because all of the references are about individuals, or about something else. Therefore this looks like an originally-synthesized subject. Still it's possible that the institution is real, and that it has been discussed somewhere, but I am unable to ascertain that. — Alalch Emis (talk) 17:53, 14 June 2021 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks,  Sandstein   21:10, 14 June 2021 (UTC)
 * Keep, possibly rename e.g. Veneration of deposed royal families in China. The article has a well-defined topic that lines up with its counterparts on other Wikipedia language editions: It is about the tradition that, when a new dynasty deposed an old one, the new king would grant a fiefdom to the royal family of the old dynasty, sometimes going back two or three dynasties. The article name may need tweaking but the topic definition is clear and there are ample reliable sources cited in the article. Deryck C. 22:05, 16 June 2021 (UTC)
 * I'm unable to identify any such sources. Could you help me with that? — Alalch Emis (talk) 20:09, 21 June 2021 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Keep agree per above. VocalIndia (talk) 16:15, 20 June 2021 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks,  Sandstein   07:34, 22 June 2021 (UTC)
 * ? Is there really any need to relist it ?, Consensus is pretty obvious here?, Cheers. VocalIndia (talk) 17:19, 22 June 2021 (UTC)
 * , not to me.  Sandstein   17:55, 22 June 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete, for me this is cut-and-dry original research (synthesis) of a topic based on unique sourcing with only the most tenuous link to string them together with. Daniel (talk) 23:44, 2 July 2021 (UTC)
 * Dlete - WP:SYNTH article with significant overlap on existing articles. MrsSnoozyTurtle 10:50, 3 July 2021 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.