Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Hello (Pop Smoke song)


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. Per HEY rework meaning general coverage is sufficient to show notability. There was an ongoing discussion as to whether the ranking alone would be sufficient, but that particular dispute ended up being rendered moot. Nosebagbear (talk) 20:48, 1 March 2021 (UTC)

Hello (Pop Smoke song)

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I am nominating this article for deletion because it has not received significant coverage; only two sources are independent of the song, which don't provide much info anyway. Also, it may have reached the charts in multiple countries but was only a top 20 hit in Greece, plus the album sources do not go into detail about the song at all and it has received a total lack of promotion. K. Peake 08:29, 22 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Albums and songs-related deletion discussions.  CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 08:32, 22 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Music-related deletion discussions.  CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 08:32, 22 February 2021 (UTC)


 * Redirect to Shoot for the Stars, Aim for the Moon as an alternative to deletion. Foxnpichu (talk) 21:59, 22 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Changing to Weak Keep in light of recent contributions. Foxnpichu (talk) 22:43, 28 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Strong Keep., I'm coming to your defense on this; hope this makes up for my FA review fail. I'm sorry, but given the many chart positions on this plus the prose on the article being a decent amount if a little small, no way should this article be touched with a deletion, redirect or merge; otherwise I'd be filling out a MeToo allegation (I suck at humor, don't I). Sure, it was "only a top 20 hit in Greece," but getting into the top 100 or even 200 of any official country or genre chart in music markets saturated with 100,000 songs is significant, especially getting into the top 100 in nine countries! For certain albums, I do merge together singles into a single page if its only a couple of minor chart positions and coverage unique to the song is nearly non-existent (see what I did with Adventures in Modern Recording), but this is not the case here. HumanxAnthro (talk) 04:43, 23 February 2021 (UTC)
 * See WP:NSONGS: "Has been ranked on national or significant music or sales charts. (Note again that this indicates only that a song may be notable, not that it is notable.)" Furthermore, the article is lacking significant coverage; aside from the announcement, the entirety of the opening section consists of info about the song that is standard for album tracks. The following section does not even give info on the proper meaning of the song, only two sentences, also literally one review is included. --K. Peake 07:02, 23 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Do you know the only reason why a lot of club hits, despite never having "significant coverage" by professional journalists cause there's no lyrical depth to them (unless we're talking about Eiffel 65's Blue), have Wikipedia pages? One reason: they got on to a shit-ton of charts worldwide, and discography articles couldn't handle listing chart positions for every single damn country for every single because the limit of charts is ten. See "2 Times" by Ann Lee, "I Like to Move It" by Reel 2 Reel and "Open Your Mind" by U.S.U.R.A. for what I'm talking about.


 * Do you comprehend the chance you have to make it on any if these nationwide charts if you were an artist? 0.1% "May" means very, very likely, and these chart positions are "significant" for a reason. Again, if this song only had a Flanders Tip chart position, I might reconsider, but it landed on what NSONGS would deem "significant" charts on nine countries. The track was in the top 40 in Canada for crying out loud (one position away from the top 30) and was also only one position away from the United States industry standard list of popular music (although on a side note I think the Rolling Stone Top 100 chart is more accurate, but that's a tale for another). You need an insane amount of individuals from these nations *listening* to these songs and *knowing* about it for many repeat listens a track to even have half a chance (f--- it, a quarter chance) of landing on the charts; it needs enough sales, streams, radio plays (which makes the Billboard positions especially relevant as they factor in radio the most, and only, like, the same five new songs play on pop radio nowadayss) to do this.


 * "the entirety of the opening section consists of info about the song that is standard for album tracks." So f---ing what? Lot's of articles about singles from other artists are the same deal. While I absolutely understand why you'd worry about the "significant coverage" (trust me, I nominated Meet the Woo Tour for merging into other articles for that same reason), the fact is the commercial performance is unique to this song, and so massive for a rap song from an American rapper a redirect or merge would be stupid. Also, this was released as a single; it's not like it's an album-only track that charted for one week as part of an "album bomb" *Cough* Scorpion *Cough*. HumanxAnthro (talk) 10:17, 23 February 2021 (UTC)


 * Plus, HipHopDX has headlined an article about the rapper with this song's name. You know what that means? It means the song is in people's head for this professional, high-quality to have to mention it to appeal to new readers. HumanxAnthro (talk) 10:25, 23 February 2021 (UTC)


 * I'll admit to be surprised the little amount of album reviews that talked about the track, given that for most other albums, every track would at least have a few reviews discussing them... Still, I stand by what I say. HumanxAnthro (talk) 10:48, 23 February 2021 (UTC)
 * I'll state a second option if the lack of non-chart coverage is overbearing. Strong Merge all chart positions (and I mean all of them) into a list of charts of the album's singles (a la that of Bjork's Vespertine but with all countries of this song included), cause that sure indicate's a moderately-performing single commercially and I don't want Canadian Hot 100 or even Bubbling Under Hot 100 positions dug up under the rug. HumanxAnthro (talk) 16:46, 23 February 2021 (UTC)
 * A Pandora award of the song being one of the best of 2020 was just added by The Ultimate Boss. That recognition by literally the second biggest streaming service probably only below Spotify only further establishes the case for this article being kept. HumanxAnthro (talk) 20:38, 24 February 2021 (UTC)
 * An award? It was listed among 50 other songs as receiving the most likes from users on the platform in a particular season of a year. Idk why that couldn't fit into an album article somewhere, if it even needs to be. They didn't "name" it anything as the article misleadingly states. Heartfox (talk) 23:55, 24 February 2021 (UTC)


 * Redirect to Shoot for the Stars, Aim for the Moon. Only 1 source (HotNewHipHop) is actual coverage independent of an album. I couldn't find other sources to add to the article, either. Per WP:NSONGS, there is not "enough material to warrant a reasonably detailed article". Heartfox (talk) 07:35, 23 February 2021 (UTC)
 * I'd also note that HotNewHipHop is probably an unreliable source. If you click on some of the articles about songs like this (in the "latest songs" column) they are never negative and sometimes lean positive to a promotional degree. This sentiment reflects what they say on their "about" page: "We are quickly becoming the premium destination for hip hop music and a promotional powerhouse for established artists and rising stars." Therefore, this article has zero reliable sources that cover the song independent of an album. Heartfox (talk) 07:44, 23 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Well, I noticed WP:RSMUSIC says otherwise but that discussion was not unanimous. Something feels off to me idk. Heartfox (talk) 07:48, 23 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Heartfox tell me. Is HotNewHipHop an unreliable source or not? The Ultimate Boss (talk) 22:06, 23 February 2021 (UTC)
 * ? I'm not the determiner of that. I just stated my opinion that I think it is problematic but that RSMUSIC thought it was reliable. Heartfox (talk) 22:40, 23 February 2021 (UTC)


 * Redirect (to Shoot for the Stars, Aim for the Moon) or Weak keep -- I normally do not think charting automatically makes a song notable, but this song did chart on seven national charts (minus NZ Heatseekers and US Bubbling), which is more than a few charts. Hardly any song could have such an impact. I would like to see the creator to expand the article regarding the song's music and lyrics. If another round of source review turns out to be fruitless, however, then redirect is the way to go. A "charted singles" section can be created in the album's article to retain charting information of this single (like the example at OK Computer). HĐ (talk) 15:49, 23 February 2021 (UTC)
 * HĐ I do not know if you'll reply but I have added more sources. The Ultimate Boss (talk) 22:06, 23 February 2021 (UTC)
 * I am seeing the Times of India and HotNewHipHop, the latter of which I am dubious about regarding reliability. HĐ (talk) 17:20, 24 February 2021 (UTC)


 * Keep I have since added more sources that discuss the song's lyrics. I also added how famous rappers like Damson Idris and Bobby Shmurda saying positive things about the song. It is also is one of the only songs which spent the most weeks on the Bubbling Under Hot 100 Singles chart without entering the Hot 100. The Ultimate Boss (talk) 07:45, 26 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Keep Hot new hip hop and Times of india (both reliable sources) discuss the song in broadness enough for the track to have its own article. MarioSoulTruthFan (talk) 22:26, 26 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Keep: Per WP:HEY and reasons above. The song has charted in several countries. Sources in the article seem reliable. That said, the article is good enough to pass WP:NSINGLE. ASTIG😎  (ICE T • ICE CUBE) 01:45, 28 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Keep: It's charted in several territories and has received enough coverage to be notable enough for an article. CAMERAwMUSTACHE (talk) 17:01, 28 February 2021 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.