Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Heraldry in Sub-Saharan Africa


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. ceradon ( talk •  contribs ) 04:07, 14 July 2015 (UTC)

Heraldry in Sub-Saharan Africa

 * – ( View AfD View log  Stats )

OR, unreferenced for 6 years, nothing encyclopedic Kintetsubuffalo (talk) 07:48, 21 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Africa-related deletion discussions. North America1000 09:48, 21 June 2015 (UTC)


 * Keep - by nothing encyclopaedic, do you mean it doesn't exist? I don't understand. There is South African heraldry, so this is encyclopaedic, but the majority of Africa is not encyclopaedic? Sub-Saharan Africa does not have flags, symbols, family crests, coats of arms? 103.27.227.205 (talk) 10:36, 21 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Comment: "Heraldry" relates to the medieval European convention of nobility in the courts of Europe. Sub-Saharan Africa did not have European courts in the medieval and early Renaissance periods. That European families are there now is undoubtable, but that's "family crests and heraldry used by Europeans in Sub-Saharan Africa." If you mean flags and signals used by kings of any sort, then that's not "heraldry." Hithladaeus (talk) 02:26, 22 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Heraldry is not only about "medieval European convention of nobility in the courts of Europe" and "medieval and early Renaissance periods" but is in use today. Even if it was introduced by European colonialists, it is still heraldry, is it not? What is this if not heraldry?  KiwikiKiWi (talk) 09:02, 22 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Then your subject is just plain heraldry used by families in sub-Saharan Africa. That means you're forking either for a genealogical purpose or to redefine the concept to cover flags and tribal markings. The former is not allowed by policy, and the latter is an unattested neologism. Is there something unique about the way European families in the sub-Saharan region perform heraldry? Hithladaeus (talk) 13:35, 22 June 2015 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Delete: The article is a definition rather than an encyclopedia article, and it's an incorrect definition at that, as it defines heraldry as tribal and ethnic markings and flags. It otherwise suggests that coats of arms for sub-Saharan families are distinct from general coats of arms. No indications of notability, references lacking, and improper focus. Hithladaeus (talk) 02:29, 22 June 2015 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, JAaron95  &#40; Talk &#41;  07:59, 28 June 2015 (UTC)  Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Keep per Kiwiki —Мандичка YO 😜 08:22, 28 June 2015 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Davewild (talk) 14:08, 5 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Delete: Whether we need an article (why "Sub-Saharan Africa" rather than just "Africa"?) of this scope is (perhaps) debatable but the article, as it stands, is hardly even a stub and actually not better than nothing. It would not make it through the WP:AFC process and, as the proposer noted, is uncited and devoid of any facts whatsoever. —Brigade Piron (talk) 22:41, 5 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Delete - unsourced, no indication of any possible content related to the subject of the supposed article, just a vague definition of heraldry connected to a random vague geographical location. Kraxler (talk) 20:10, 12 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Delete I'm not too impressed by the arguments that Heraldry specifically refers to something that happens (happened?) in Europe.  For all I know, that may be true, but if so, it simply means the article needs a better title.  Maybe Tribal symbols in Sub-Sahara Africa?.  But, the bottom line, there's no real article here.  It's a cross between a six year old stub and a dictdef.  If somebody really wants to write on this subject, they can always create a new article (perhaps under a better title).  -- RoySmith (talk) 23:13, 13 July 2015 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.