Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/History of Iranian Football Club In Asian Tournaments


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   delete. fish &amp;karate 10:16, 24 September 2008 (UTC)

History of Iranian Football Club In Asian Tournaments

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Article listing the results of Iranian football clubs playing in continental tournaments. IMO this falls under Wikipedia is not an indiscriminate collection of information, as I can't really see that much point to it. пﮟოьεԻ  5  7  20:42, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
 * This discussion has been included in WikiProject Football's list of association football related deletions. пﮟოьεԻ   5  7  20:42, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete per nom. – PeeJay 20:46, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment - Really? Please explain how this is indiscriminate - it is organised by tournament and year. TerriersFan (talk) 22:12, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I do not believe that detailing the performances of a certain country's clubs in Asian competitions is that beneficial. We don't even have this sort of article for European countries. Then you get countries like Israel, Kazakhstan and Australia, who have changed confederations. How do we deal with those? Then there's the question of how much is too much. Should this article be split into History of Iranian football clubs in the AFC Champions League, History of Iranian football clubs in the AFC Cup, etc.? And then there's the point that the article's title doesn't even use good grammar. Perhaps my endorsement of the WP:INDISCRIMINATE reason was incorrect, but the reasons I have provided above surely aren't. – PeeJay 14:22, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep - nothing indiscriminate about this - it is discriminate, organised and encyclopaedic. TerriersFan (talk) 21:43, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete this list of football tournament results seems to be a little too specific for inclusion in Wikipedia, per WP:SALAT and WP:NOTDIR. Also, notable tournament results seem to already be covered fairly comprehensively on the Iran national football team page. --ColorOfSuffering (talk) 08:45, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment - This list is of results achieved by Iranian clubs, and has nothing whatsoever to do with the Iran national football team...... -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 08:49, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment Ah...sorry. Tripped up by the missing plural noun.  All the same, I still don't see the benefit of a single country's multiple clubs' performances in a single continent's multiple tournaments.  If someone is interested in the results of a club, why not go to the specific club's page?  --ColorOfSuffering (talk) 05:34, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete per nom. GiantSnowman 17:35, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Iran-related deletion discussions.   --  Fabrictramp  |  talk to me  23:12, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Merge into relevant tournament articles, then delete. The information has a place on wikipedia, but not as an indiscriminate list. Everything here belongs either on the club articles or tournament articles. I suggest making the article available to significant contributor(s) after deletion to speed this process up. BeL1EveR (talk) 04:41, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep - this article as same as Iraqi clubs at the AFC Champions League, Thai clubs at the AFC Champions League and Thai Clubs in Asian Club Championship.Shahin (talk) 09:42, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
 * WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS is not a valid argument. пﮟოьεԻ   5  7  10:02, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS may be a valid argument for inclusion. You really need to read the complete guideline.  Blanket application of the guideline as you have done just isn't consistent with what the guideline really says.  In a deletion debate, both the Keepers and Deleters need to explain carefully how The Other Stuff clearly relates or clearly doesn't relate to the article under question.--Mike Cline (talk) 10:23, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep - This article is really helpfull and it's also organised. There shouldn't even be the talk about deleting this article. It should be kept because it is helpfull. Sohrab 0611 (talk) 18:16, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
 * How on earth is it helpful? All the results are covered in other articles on the various Asian competitions. пﮟოьεԻ   5  7  19:59, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Because it provides a collated overview without the reader having to trawl through several other pages and extract the information themselves. TerriersFan (talk) 20:34, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Like the contributor above, I really can't see why a collation of a single country's clubs' results is necessary. пﮟოьεԻ   5  7  22:00, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I understand. You are English. it may not be so Important to have an article for a Country like England, because every season at least 4 English clubs participate in Champions League and usually play strongly and win the cup. but its different for Iranian clubs, Iranian clubs have won Asian titles only 4 times.Amirreza  (talk) 12:21, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Also, I've just noticed that this is a canvassed vote. пﮟოьεԻ   5  7  22:05, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I've described bellow about what you think is canvassed vote. Amirreza (talk) 12:21, 19 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Keep - Including information like this in the club page instead of a page like Iranian football club in asian tournaments will make the already packed Iranian club pages larger and less comprehensible. Nokhodi (talk) 01:02, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Canvassed vote. пﮟოьεԻ   5  7  07:17, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so that consensus may be reached. Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks,  Jerry   delusional ¤ kangaroo 01:54, 19 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Keep Seems to me to be a reasonably discriminate list, so doesn't fail WP:IINFO. Nominator has given no examples of how this list is indiscriminate. RMHED (talk) 02:30, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * It is indiscriminate because there is no explanation as to why we need a separate list of results just for clubs from one country when they are all available on the existing articles on the cups. пﮟოьεԻ   5  7  07:17, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete - I believe the relevant part of WP:INDISCRIMINATE that Number 57 is referring to here is "Long and sprawling lists of statistics may be confusing to readers and reduce the readability and neatness of our articles. In addition, articles should contain sufficient explanatory text to put statistics within the article in their proper context for a general reader." That certainly describes this page. If we were to produce a page called History of English football clubs in European Tournaments, it'd probably take all day to read it! As the page in question stands, it really is far too long and specific to be on Wikipedia. Any pertinent information (such as any tournament successes) should be included into a broader History of football in Iran, or something to that effect. Obviously a lot of work has gone into this page - perhaps the page's creator should set up a specialist Wiki dedicated to Iranian football where this kind of info would be much better suited? Bettia   (rawr CRUSH!)  08:28, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * As an addendum to the "too long" comment, the fact that it is so big and has so many templates is actually causing problems for my browser, as it takes at least 10-15 seconds to load it. пﮟოьεԻ   5  7  08:34, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep I find nothing Indiscriminate about this article and indeed its just the kind of interesting and clearly for some helpful encyclopedic article that makes WP an outstanding encyclopedic research tool. I also detect a bit of the WP:IDONTLIKEIT syndrome has creeped into this debate--Mike Cline (talk) 10:38, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I agree with Mike Cline, this is "I don't like". Number 57 is the one who put the deletion template on the article and wants to delete this page. there is another poll about deletion of this article dated 14 September 2008 and the result was keep. another admin should vote here. Amirreza (talk) 12:10, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Aside from the fact that this is another canvassed vote and should therefore be discounted, this is not WP:IDONTLIKEIT. I've made it quite clear that not only des this list fails to serve any useful purpose because the information is already present elsewhere, but its unwieldy size makes it problematic for internet browsers. пﮟოьεԻ   5  7  12:33, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment I believe that If anyone wants to know about Iranian football clubs performance in Asia, this article includes useful information. It's just like List of Iranian footballers in European clubs that shows useful information about Iranian football. It may be written bad or reverses some guidelines but I think we should keep this information here or somewhere else. anyway IMO we should keep this information. now if there is a move to another article, lets move it. but I say no to deletion. Amirreza (talk) 11:53, 19 September 2008 (UTC)


 * about canvassed vote: I saw Number 57's undo on my talkpage we are a team working on Iranian football and creating such an article is a groupwork so there is not any canvassed vote. we are symphonic. He just predicated us. Amirreza  (talk) 11:53, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * The deleted text was "please help us to keep this article", which reads like canvassing for votes to me. Dancarney (talk) 12:17, 19 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Delete - this article doesn't appear to be at all useful. The information would be much more meaningful in articles for the individual teams and competitions and left as it is would set a worrying precedent for similar articles on European football. Something along the lines of History of Spanish clubs in European Tournaments would be horrendous. I don't see how List of Iranian footballers in European clubs is warranted either. Dancarney (talk) 12:17, 19 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Delete, lists of every game that an Iranian club has played in a continental competition belongs in an almanac, not an encyclopedia. WP:IINFO seems to be the main policy here and it fails it by a long shot. --Jimbo[online] 13:41, 19 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Transwiki somewhere. It is a little too much detail for Wikipedia, but it is useful and should be preserved, however, I'm not sure a wiki for this topic has been set up. There are better places to find this information for UEFA tournaments, but I don't know of any for AFC… is this appropriate for Wikibooks? MTC (talk) 19:27, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete per nom. The information is an indiscriminate disorganised mess which I cannot make head nor tail of, and I understand football. God help anyone who doesn't know anything about the subject. Peanut4 (talk) 20:35, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete per nom. GiantSnowman 17:56, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Strong delete per items 1-4, 6, and 8 at WP:LC. Stifle (talk) 09:26, 24 September 2008 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.