Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Hryhory Bazhul


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   keep. King of &hearts;   &diams;   &clubs;  &spades; 10:43, 25 March 2011 (UTC)

Hryhory Bazhul

 * – ( View AfD View log )

fails WP:BIO and WP:MUSICBIO, nothing in gnews for his name in both English and Ukrainian. even in google his name in Ukrainian only reveals WP mirros. gbooks reveals 6 hits but no evidence of indepth coverage. LibStar (talk) 04:55, 18 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Strong keep. There are non-English sources.
 * Delete He is mentioned in some books, but he is not the subject of them. Otherwise fails WP:BIO. -- TYelliot &#124;  Talk  &#124;  Contribs  12:07, 18 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Comment Reply to above unsigned comment: please provide links to these sources. -- TYelliot &#124;  Talk  &#124;  Contribs  12:07, 18 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Ever tried googling? http://www.google.com/search?q=%D0%B3%D1%80%D0%B8%D0%B3%D0%BE%D1%80%D1%96%D0%B9+%D0%B1%D0%B0%D0%B6%D1%83%D0%BB&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:uk:official&client=firefox-a .--Galassi (talk) 14:59, 18 March 2011 (UTC)
 * many seem WP mirrors. See WP:GOOGLEHITS. LibStar (talk) 16:06, 18 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Ukraine-related deletion discussions.  -- • Gene93k (talk) 15:06, 18 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Australia-related deletion discussions.  -- • Gene93k (talk) 15:06, 18 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Bands and musicians-related deletion discussions.  -- • Gene93k (talk) 15:07, 18 March 2011 (UTC)


 * Keep. There is a monograph currently being prepared for publication about him. There is also a corner in a state museum in Ukraine with his instrument, paintings and concert posters on display. Google gives us 3500 hit in articles where he is mentioned. ````
 * this monograph is not published so can't count as a source. See WP:GOOGLEHITS. LibStar (talk) 03:41, 20 March 2011 (UTC)


 * He did take up about a third of my doctorate dissertation which is published and also an english language book on Ukrainian Folk Instruments published in Melbourne in 1984. Bandurist (talk) 03:50, 20 March 2011 (UTC)
 * then you should have no problem supplying us third party sources. LibStar (talk) 04:09, 20 March 2011 (UTC)


 * Additional tertiary sources have been added. Bandurist (talk) 13:29, 20 March 2011 (UTC)
 * could you please add as inline citation as per WP:INCITE. LibStar (talk) 02:18, 21 March 2011 (UTC)


 * @LibStar, assuming citations are added, are we done here or do you have other concerns? These affairs sometimes turn into an endless series of "but now, what about this?" hurdles, just checking. P ЄTЄRS J V ►TALK 02:07, 23 March 2011 (UTC)

Strong Keep: Again, another irresponsible nomination by User:LibStar targeting Ukrainian-related articles. I strongly oppose this nomination on these grounds: Someone competent in the Ukrainian language would find, just using the internet, that Hryhory Bazhul was notable enough to be mentioned in: NOTE : most of the above references also mention the Hnat Khotkevych Ukrainian Bandurist Ensemble — as Hryhory Bazhul was its founder, and also mention that Bazhul was the student of another famous Ukrainian bandurist — Hnat Khotkevych. --Pkravchenko (talk) 10:37, 24 March 2011 (UTC)
 * 1) As evidenced previously the nominator has no competency in this area, and not having a basic command of Ukrainian makes it impossible for him to do effective internet searches to justify his nominations (or to properly assess the significance of a Ukrainian-related subject). As suggested by another editor — User:LibStar "should be required to contact someone who knows the language in the  proper Wikiproject before trying to delete an article".
 * 2) The nominator has improperly claimed as a 'fact' that not having 'hits' on Google News = "failing WP:BIO and WP:MUSICBIO". Nowhere in any WP policies does it say that 'hits' on any search site should be used as the only criterion for deletion. It is also ridiculous to expect Google News (which only has limited access to some archived news media) to have hits on all notable people who have been dead since 1989 !
 * 3) Wikipedia deletions policy and etiquette (WP:BEFORE) requires that a  or other appropriate tag should be placed, instead of a deletion notice as a first step. I quote: "If the page can be improved, this should be solved through regular editing, rather than deletion." (WP:ATD. Unfortunately, User:LibStar does not even bother notifying the creator/main contributor of the article, thus preventing anyone the opportunity to improve the article, before it is potentially deleted without their knowledge.
 * 1) Ukrainian news articles:
 * 2) * Кравченко, М. "Все про кобзарство", Київська Правда № 13 (22649) понеділок 7 лютого 2011 року (Kravchenko, M. "All about kobzar art", an article about the Kobzar-bandura museum in Pereyaslava-Khmelnytska in Ukraine).
 * 3) * Атаманюк, Ю. "Гнат Хоткевич і гуцульський театр", «Час і Події», Львів 01/03/2008 номер #2008-01 (Atamaniuk, Y. "Hnat Khotkevych and the hutzul theatre", Time and Events, Lviv 01/03/2008)
 * 4) At least ten issues (between 1972 and 1995) of the largest circulating Ukrainian-language diaspora newspaper Svoboda (existing since 1893, and all issues available online):
 * 5) * Svoboda-1972-146.pdf
 * 6) * Svoboda-1973-178.pdf
 * 7) * Svoboda-1979-041.pdf
 * 8) * Svoboda-1986-097.pdf
 * 9) * Svoboda-1987-008.pdf
 * 10) * Svoboda-1990-010.pdf
 * 11) * Svoboda-1991-144.pdf
 * 12) * Svoboda-1991-209.pdf
 * 13) * Svoboda-1991-209.pdf
 * 14) * Svoboda-1995-109.pdf
 * 15) At least one issue of the largest English-language Ukrainian newspaper in the Ukrainian diaspora, The Ukrainian Weekly:
 * 16) * The_Ukrainian_Weekly_1990-48.pdf
 * 17) The international Bandura journal (issued in New York):
 * 18) * Мішалов В. "Перший семінар присвячений харківському способу гри на бандурі" / ("First seminar commemorating the Kharkiv style of bandura playing") Bandura № (75) 2001, p. 22.
 * 19) * Кобза i пiсня - Ансамбль бандуристiв iм. Г. Хоткевича (Австралiя), Петро Деряжний-керiвник Review: "The kobza and song - The Hnat Khotkevych Ukrainian Bandurist Ensemble, conducted by Peter Deriashnyj, conductor. Bandura №2(6) 1982
 * 20) These journals, mostly available in full from the Vernadsky National Library of Ukraine:
 * 21) * Стенограма засідання спеціалізованої вченої ради Д 64.807.01 Харківської державної академії культури, Протокол № 35, 20 лютого 2009 (Verbatim record — Minutes No.35, 20 February 2009, of the special academic board of the uk:Kharkiv National Academy of Culture, in the evaluation of the thesis "The cultural-artistic aspects of the genesis and development of the Kharkiv method of bandura playing" by doctorate candidate Victor Mishalow.) Record of discussion by 16 academic experts.
 * 22) * Жеплинський, Б. М., Кобзарськими стежинами: науково-публіцистичне дослідження НАН України, Львівська наукова бібліотека ім. В.Стефаника. - Л. : [б.в., 2002. - 277 с.: фотоіл.] ISBN 966-02-1422-7 (Zheplynsky B. M, Paths of the Kobzars: scientific publication investigations, National Academy of Sciences of Ukraine, Lviv National Library Lviv).
 * 23) * Обух, Л. Типологія освітніх інституцій кобзарського мистецтва українського зарубіжжя (за матеріалами журналу ,,Бандура”) // Наукові збірки Львівської національної музичної академії ім. М.В. Лисенка,  Вип. 21  2009 (Obukh, L. Typology of educational institutions of kobzar art in the Ukrainian diaspora'')  — available online from the The Vernadsky National Library of Ukraine.
 * 24) * Дутчак, В. "Музична і науково-методична спадщина Гната Хоткевича в українському зарубіжжі." Вісник Прикарпатського університету. Мистецтвознавство 2008. Вип. 12. (Karas, H. "Activities of educational institutions in kobzar art in the diaspora",  Newsletter Precarpathian University. Art studies issue № 12, p.151-155) —  available online from the The Vernadsky National Library of Ukraine.
 * 25) * Карась, Г. "Діяльність освітніх інституцій кобзарського мистецтва в діаспорі: джерелознавчий аспект", Вісник Прикарпатського університету. Мистецтвознавство 2009. Вип. 15–16. (Karas, H. "Activities of educational institutions in kobzar art in the diaspora", Newsletter Precarpathian University. Art studies issue № 15–16) —  available online from the The Vernadsky National Library of Ukraine.
 * 26) * Бобченко, О. "Жіноче бандурне виконавство в українському зарубіжжі: персоналії та колективи", «Виконавці та виконавство» Музикознавчі студії Інституту мистецтв Волинського національного університету імені Лесі Українки та Національної музичної академії України імені П. І. Чайковського (Bobchenko, O. "Ladies bandura performance in the Ukrainian diaspora: personalities and groups.") —  available online from the The Vernadsky National Library of Ukraine.
 * 27) * Дутчак В. Г. "Традиції харківського способу гри в практиці бандуристів українського зарубіжжя" «Проблеми сучасної педагогічної освіти» Випуск №14, частина 1 (Dutchak V. "Traditional Kharkiv style of playing by bandurists in the Ukrainian diaspora") —  available online from the The Vernadsky National Library of Ukraine.
 * 28) * Зьола, М. "Кобзарське мистецтво в грамзапису" журнал «Вітчизна» №7-8, 2005 р (Літературно-художній та громадсько-політичний журнал письменників України) (Zolia, M. "Kobzar art in gramophone recordings", Motherland)
 * see WP:ADHOM you should not attack the nominator. WP does not require users to know all foreign languages to participate. LibStar (talk) 11:44, 24 March 2011 (UTC)
 * a) Yes, there are plenty of WP policies regarding etiquette, including the requirement, to notify creators/significant authors of articles if you are nominating their article for deletion (with the privileged powers of an administrator). In my opinion, the act of nominating an article for deletion, without first trying to improve it, and without notifying the author, is not in the spirit of Wikipedia and certainly not in accordance with the "high standard of conduct" expected of administrators.
 * b) "participating" is a long way off from nominating an article for deletion, especially if you don't have any background in the subject, or language. --Pkravchenko (talk) 14:54, 24 March 2011 (UTC)
 * 100s of articles are nominated each week for deletion, and in the vast majority of cases the creator is not notified. There is no requirement to, and I don't see you complaining at other AfDs about this. Nor can this be an argument for keeping. WP places no restriction/prequalification on what articles can be nominated for deletion by a user. Perhaps you feel you WP:OWN Ukrainian subject articles in WP and no one else can nominate them? LibStar (talk) 20:41, 24 March 2011 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.