Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Hubert Brasier


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was redirect to Theresa May. Black Kite (talk) 14:34, 31 July 2016 (UTC)

Hubert Brasier

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Contested prod. We do not have articles on the fathers of the majority of recent British Prime Ministers, where we do have them they have some additional claim to notability, e.g. Alfred Roberts was an important local politician. Spouses of Prime Ministers are different as they do tend to attract some significant media attention. Also, why have an article on Theresay May's father but not her mother? PatGallacher (talk) 11:07, 16 July 2016 (UTC)


 * Comment. For a standalone article, there should be some sources attesting independent notability, i.e. I should look down at the list of sources and not see only articles about Theresa May.  Otherwise there is a strong case to be made for merging the entirety back to her article; a section of this length about her father should be reasonable to keep completely there. Wnt (talk) 11:32, 16 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of United Kingdom-related deletion discussions. for  (talk)  14:17, 16 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Christianity-related deletion discussions. for  (talk)  14:18, 16 July 2016 (UTC)
 * pinging contributors at discussion of the PROD on the article's talk page... ,,, for (talk)  14:22, 16 July 2016 (UTC)


 * Merge per Wnt. There's enough here for a nice section on her background, but probably not for a standalone article, unless he did other stuff that we don't know about yet. This is Paul (talk) 16:41, 16 July 2016 (UTC)


 * Comment I have just checked, prior to May there have been 13 British Prime Ministers since WW2, only 5 of their fathers have an article, even fewer of their mothers. Randolph Churchill was a leading national politician, the Earl of Home was of course an earl, Alfred Roberts was an important local politician, Tom Major-Ball had a significant stage career, and Leo Blair had a significant career as an academic and activist. PatGallacher (talk) 20:47, 16 July 2016 (UTC)


 * Delete. The originator admits on the talk page that its creation was speculative. There is nothing noteworthy here that is not already in the Theresa May article. The unremarkable career details of this regular Anglican ecclesiatic are nowhere near notable and should not be in the TM article.Davidships (talk) 15:49, 17 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Redirect to Theresa May. Notability cannot be inherited from his daughter.  This article may provide slightly more detail on his career than there would be room for in her article, but I doubt we need that.  NN.  Peterkingiron (talk) 18:03, 17 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Note that notability can, in fact, be inherited, on Wikipedia as in real life: WP:INHERIT explicitly states: "Individuals in close, personal relationships with famous people (including politicians) can have an independent article even if they are known solely for such a relationship, but only if they pass WP:GNG."  This is how we come to have articles on a grocer named Alfred Roberts, and an attorney named Leo Blaire who would not have merited Wikipedia articles if they had been childless. Lord Randolph would  have had an article even if he had never had a son, but parents of Prime Ministers, often attract sufficient press coverage to support an article.E.M.Gregory (talk) 19:07, 18 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Keep Times may be changing, the British media may be nosier than they used to be, or maybe it's that nosey American media are digging up info on the Prime Minister's Dad that British media didn't bother with , but there is coverage of her Dad. Reporters are out there digging this stuff up , , .  If we colonists are responsible for spreading our obsession with the President's family to an unwilling mother country, then, as an American, I apologize. But I do think that the level of media interest means that the article stays.E.M.Gregory (talk) 01:14, 19 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Redirect to Theresa May, per Peterkingiron. Even allowing for E.M.Gregory's argument that there is media interest the fact is, after TM's 6 years in one of the Great Offices of State, a couple of weeks as a Prime-ministerial candidate, and a week in the job, the media have yet to find anything interesting about him. for (talk)  10:38, 19 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Where is it written that the subject of an article has to be "interesting"?E.M.Gregory (talk) 21:59, 19 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Just so you know, We have kept relatives of contemporary American politician with no sources at all other than stores generated by their relationship to a candidate. We have had a lot of very similar U.S. discussions recently, there were are sources at all dating to the period before the spouse (Karen Pence, Todd Palin, or Michael Haley (South Carolina)) Governor, or Senator Jeanette Dousdebes Rubio, Ditto for several others  in this category who now have pages.  But if Trump wins, we will will inevitably have a page on  a gas station owner named Edward J. Pence, Jr..  Maybe sooner.  This is not to say that Britain needs to follow suit; it's just that since I worked on those AFDs and remember those pages (some of which I created), I want to let editors considering this quesiton know what's out there.E.M.Gregory (talk) 11:40, 19 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Just want to add that I created pages on both sides - Jane O'Meara Sanders - to level the playing field, in a situation where some of the candidates spouses had pages, and others didn't.  But even for the spouse who had had a career as a cheerleader for the Miami Dolphins, neither I nor anyone else could find so much as a press mention of her cheer-leading career until her husband became prominent.  Adding this so that other editors will know how what standards have recently been applied to close kin of U.S. politicians, Britons may with to apply different standards.E.M.Gregory (talk) 11:40, 19 July 2016 (UTC)
 * A Rachel Sylvester essay in The Times is echoed in today's The Australian "Just as Margaret Thatcher’s world view was informed by living above her father’s grocer’s shop in Grantham, Mrs May’s character and politics were forged in a rural Oxfordshire rectory.  An only child, the prime minister learnt early in life that she was always “on show”. The parishioners of her father, the Rev Hubert Brasier, would arrive unannounced at any time of the day or night. Whether baking scones for the village fete with her mother or listening to the cricket with her father, the young Theresa felt a heavy burden of expectations, once explaining that as a clergyman’s daughter, “you’re supposed to behave in a particular way. Living next to the church, she acquired the discipline and determination that have led her all the way to Downing Street — but she also learnt..." .E.M.Gregory (talk) 20:29, 19 July 2016 (UTC)


 * Redirect as best known for being the father, nothing to suggest his own convincing article. SwisterTwister   talk  19:24, 25 July 2016 (UTC)
 * sources Details about his life are being researched, published  Here's The Times on how Dad's unique college influenced him and his daughter's career .  There does seem to be enough to pass WP:GNG.E.M.Gregory (talk) 09:34, 28 July 2016 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.