Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Ina Fried


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   no consensus. Cirt (talk) 00:33, 1 October 2008 (UTC)

Ina Fried

 * ( [ delete] ) – (View AfD) (View log)

Fails Bio. The subject is a journalist without journalism awards. The subject was for a couple of years a board member in the NLGJA, an activist organization, but even the president of this organization lacks an article, and the organization's notability is under challenge. The only sources for this article come from CNET which acknowledges her as part of its staff and from the NLGJA. The NLGJA sources now no longer mention Ina at all (though I verified that they once did). None of the sources used feature Ina as its subject. As a result, I see no grounds for inclusion under any of Wikipedia's notability criteria. Last month I attached the "prod" tag to this article, but it was quickly removed. Rklawton (talk) 12:40, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

*Keep Notable also as a transgender journalist. Me Love You Short Time (talk) 04:14, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete - I see no indication of notability. - TexasAndroid (talk) 12:59, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete, doesn't seem to meet WP:BIO. Stifle (talk) 15:14, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete fails WP:BIO completly.  abf  /talk to me/  15:18, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete fails WP:BIO / decidedly NN - A l is o n  ❤ 18:21, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete No real claim to notability. Dzhugashvili (talk) 19:55, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Living people-related deletion discussions. --Erwin85Bot (talk) 00:00, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
 * ''Blocked as a sockpuppet of -  A l is o n  ❤ 04:22, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

Delete. Non-notable awards do not confer notability. Every organisation in the world gives out awards nowadays - neither these awards nor their winners are notable. Hence delete if that is the only claim to notability.Yobmod (talk) 10:17, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Authors-related deletion discussions.   --  Fabrictramp  |  talk to me  16:45, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete No real claim to notability fails WP:BIO. nochaos, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
 * On the basis of awards: Do Not Delete / Keep. Awards:
 * 1) Three time winner of NewsBios/TJFR award - "30 Most Influential Business Journalists Under 30."
 * 2) While at CNET, she won a Maggie Award from the Western Publications Association for Outstanding Editorial Content in 2006.
 * 3) She also won two awards in 2005 from the Society of Professional Journalists (Northern California Chapter) autumn59, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Sexuality and gender-related deletion discussions.   —Autumn59 (talk) 05:52, 30 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Note: our guidelines state that the awards themselves must be notable.  #1 "30 Most Influential Business Journalists Under 30" has exactly 6 references in Google.  The award appears primarily important to CNET, Ina's employer.  #3 is a regional award and clearly fails our notability standards.  #2 (the Maggie award) might be a notable award and worth considering.  Does anyone have any insights?  The fact that Ina doesn't appear to be the subject of any articles – especially peculiar given she's an online journalist – makes me doubt that she's especially notable within the community of her peers.  Rklawton (talk) 21:35, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
 * The WPA - which produces the "Maggie Award" is a regional, not national organization. It also lacks an article on Wikipedia, though that could be an oversight.  While this award has three sources, one is from the WPA and the other two are PR pieces about the award.  Rklawton (talk) 00:32, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep Notability as a transgender writer working for a major media outlet. That provides her with a notoriety among her peers.  Given that transgender people have faced barriers in getting fair recognition within their given industries - I would argue that the lack of awards from places people here agree with is an invalid argument for removal. Varnent (talk) 00:42, 30 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep Varnent said it well. Notable for being an out transgender senior writer in a major media outlet and for holding a leadership position at NLGJA. She gets 300k+ hits on Google and has been interviewed as an expert on NPR's All Things Considered & Talk of the Nation. She's interviewed Bill Gates and Steve Jobs. I agree the article isn't in the best shape, but Fried is notable. Please give the article a little more time to reflect that. Queerudite (talk) 01:42, 30 September 2008 (UTC)
 * The article was prodded a month ago, and an SPA has been active at trying to improve it - so what you have is the best available. Rklawton (talk) 03:43, 30 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep. Awards:
 * 1) The 2003 award from the Society of Professional Journalists is a be notable award. SPJ is the most-recognized professional journalism organization in the United States. oaklandnjb 02:07, 30 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Keep. Plenty of reliable sources available, this is a prominent journalist who also serves on a national board. They've also received awards for their work. semi-protect if needed, WP:RBI the vandals and start fleshing out the article. What seems to also be noteworthy is that they transitioned and avoided their transition being the story while still being a frontline news reporter. That should be included in the lede but I'm unsyre the wording. -- Banj e  b oi   05:49, 30 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Keep Google News archive shows 1360 hits for "Ina Fried" indicating satisfaction of WP:N and WP:BIO, via Fried being the not only the author of articles in ZNET but featured on National Public Radio and quoted in Newswireless.net, UK, Gearlog, New York, iTwire, Australia, Motley Fool, and Seattle Times. Fried was called "la experta en Windows" by Diario TI, Spain.  Fried's work at Znet/CDnet has led to worldwide notability. Google book search also shows that Fried's work has been cited numerous times. . Metroweekly had a feature article about Fried's gender change . Edison (talk) 06:07, 30 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Disgusted Keep that no one appearantly even made the most basic of efforts to try to find notability or sources. The Maggie award is notable enough. I definately don't buy the "notable in transgender" argument, since it's not even a guideline, but the amount of coverage she's recieved from other sources is enough. As time passes, notability becomes harder to find, but that doesn't suddenly mean they weren't notable. -- Logical Premise Ergo? 17:58, 30 September 2008 (UTC)
 * You raise a good point. Perhaps the Prod template - which reads that it can be removed "for any reason" and prohibits re-posting the template even when no reason is provided - should be revised.  Had the prod template remained in place, editors would have had ample opportunity to revise the article without the fuss of an AfD.  Rklawton (talk) 18:55, 30 September 2008 (UTC)
 * G-hits, minor awards, and quotes from various news agencies does not make a journalist notable. In fact, that sort of thing is normal for a journalist.  What we need here is some indication that this is a notable journalist.  Rklawton (talk) 18:55, 30 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Fully aware of that. WP:CREATIVE is rather vague on journalists -- are the only notable journalists the ones who have one an award? (Not a rhetorical question, if there is one, I should learn about it!) She is widely cited. Not 100% sure about the Maggie Award.-- Logical Premise Ergo? 19:05, 30 September 2008 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.