Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/James Tomlin


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete.  Keep arguments failed to establish notability outside of WP:ATHLETE or WP:BASEBALL. No comment on the relative merits of WP:BASEBALL versus WP:ATHLETE, as AfD is not the place to discuss that issue. lifebaka++ 13:38, 11 August 2008 (UTC)

James Tomlin

 * ( [ delete] ) – (View AfD) (View log)


 * Delete. Another career minor-league baseball player.  Low-round draft pick now in his 9th year with three different organizations while never getting past AA ball. —Wknight94 (talk) 13:44, 28 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Baseball-related deletion discussions.   ——Wknight94 (talk) 13:49, 28 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Weak Delete - fails WP:ATHLETE.-- S R X  14:00, 28 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep Appalachian League All-Star in 2001. Spanneraol (talk) 14:21, 28 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep. Minor-league All-Stars are notable. -Hit bull, win steak(Moo!) 15:49, 28 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep Consensus at WP:BASEBALL has well established that minor league all-stars are notable. Kinston eagle (talk) 17:36, 28 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment. As I'm seeing now, the "consensus" at the various notability discussions have generally involved just two or three folks already biased to one side and/or banned users like .  —Wknight94 (talk) 17:38, 28 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Actually, Jmfangio was one of the few people in the discussions who DIDN'T agree with the consensus. Fortunately, his banning provided an easy means of resolution... -Hit bull, win steak(Moo!) 14:51, 29 July 2008 (UTC)
 * I didn't say which way he leaned - I was pointing out that he was banned and therefore not technically part of the discussion. So you're left with two or three biased people apparently deciding a guideline nine months ago.  That doesn't sound like a quorum to me.  —Wknight94 (talk) 14:58, 29 July 2008 (UTC)
 * The debate was open for sometime... Others did not object at the time, or in the nine months since we adopted this. Spanneraol (talk) 18:51, 29 July 2008 (UTC)


 * Strong Keep per WPBB
 * Have played in at least a whole season in AAA baseball, played in the All-Star Futures Game, won a notable Minor League Baseball award, or been selected for any minor league baseball All-star game in the affiliated minor leagues. SashaNein (talk) 17:42, 28 July 2008 (UTC)


 * Keep All-stars justifiably clear the WP:BASEBALL notability guideline. Townlake (talk) 18:42, 28 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete As I have stated in similar nominations on this page, I think the WP:BASEBALL and WP:ATHLETE standards are far too generous. Notability guidelines are not meant purely for fans, but also for the average educated reader. Minor league players should not be notable absent significant coverage in their own right by nonlocal sources. RayAYang (talk) 20:02, 28 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete. Bios in encyclopedia are intended for people that are widely accepted as the elite in their profession. This person is not a notable baseball player. There are thousands upon thousands of baseball players that have accomplished as much as him. If he is equal to thousands upon thousands of other players it doesn't make any sense for there to be an article about him in an encyclopedia. For those editors that won't accept an argument at an afd discussion that doesn't include wikilinked abbreviations here goes: Delete. No coverage in WP:RS, thus not meeting WP:BIO. WP:BB is a Wikiproject, thus any notability standard they come up with doesn't trump WP:BIO. -- brew crewer  (yada, yada) 23:22, 28 July 2008 (UTC)
 * There have also been thousands and thousands of members of Congress. Should we also seek to purge those articles, merely because they are numerous? As to the canard about media coverage, there are plenty of sources available for nearly anyone in the upper levels of organized baseball. Just because you are not interested in seeking them out and improving the article, does not mean that they aren't there. -Hit bull, win steak(Moo!) 14:57, 29 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Politics is a decent analogy. Congress is above that certain line that most people have determined to be notable - maybe you disagree with that and you're welcome to try to change it, but for now, that's the case.  Local assembly is not.  Local assembly is not considered notable (I assume) because there are many many times more people in that group and none of them have the name recognition that people in Congress have.  Local assembly is like single-A ball while Congress is like the majors.  Single-A ball has seen many many times as many people as the majors and none of them have the name recognition that people in the majors have.  —Wknight94 (talk) 19:14, 29 July 2008 (UTC)
 * But just because some politicians below the level of Congress are not notable, does not mean that all politicians below that level are not notable. If Congress is where we draw the line for inherent notability (as MLB/top-level foreign leagues for baseball), then anything below that is going to be determined on a case-by-case basis. As an aid to such, we've drawn up guidelines to aid in making that determination - and an appearance in a minor league All Star game is one of the best ways of sorting the sheep from the goats. -Hit bull, win steak(Moo!) 19:54, 29 July 2008 (UTC)


 * Delete - Tomlin's only claim to notability is a selection to a rookie league all-star team in 2001. Despite what the WikiProject's criteria say, I don't think that's sufficient to signify a player's "historical notability." BRMo (talk) 03:28, 1 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so that consensus may be reached. Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, I closed this earlier as No consensus, this was objected to so I have undone my close and relisted in order to try to get a clear consensus formed. RMHED (talk) 19:12, 3 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Delete Fails WP:ATHLETE. Undeath (talk) 20:44, 3 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete - per nom. Fails WP:ATHLETE --T-rex 00:24, 4 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Strong Keep - Was a minor league all-star, hence meets the notability requirements of WP:BASEBALL. If we don't like those notability requirements we should get consensus to change them, not selectively apply them. Rlendog (talk) 02:31, 7 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep - I'm not thrilled with the idea of Rookie-class league all-stars being notable, but according to WP:BASEBALL they are. Remember, WP:ATHLETE says "competitors who have competed in a fully professional league" are considered notable, not players in a top-level pro league. Discussions on whether athletes like Tomlin are notable must be held at a higher level than a single AfD.  Giants2008  ( 17-14 ) 03:43, 9 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete - no claim to notability. Being paid to play baseball alone does not imply notability. No large accomplishments, or play in the top league of any nation. --T-rex 04:34, 10 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete. His all-star appearance was in the rookie league, that's not quite notable. IF he makes an all-star team where he is now, that would be notable, but alas he fails WP:ATHLETE. Wizardman  22:18, 10 August 2008 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.