Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Japan (2023 film)


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was Draftify. Moving this article to Draft space per consensus and common practice. Note that a quick move back to main space could result in the article being deleted. Liz Read! Talk! 22:28, 24 November 2022 (UTC)

Japan (2023 film)

 * – ( View AfD View log | edits since nomination)

Fails WP:NFF. Not yet released, no indication that production was notable. DRAFT or delete until release.

PROD removed by the editor who moved the article from draft with reasoning "user doing improper editing multiple times - need to be reported", which seems is more of a personal attack against nominator WP:PA because they were upset that an article they created was nominated rather than move it back to draft until release.

Not sure why adding a PROD to a seemingly non-notable unreleased film is "improper editing" since there is no policy to back up that statement. In any case, this film has many citations about it being announced or a poster being released, but nothing of significance to establish notability as Wikipedia is not a film database site. Donald D23  talk to me  23:45, 17 November 2022 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Film and India.  Donald D23   talk to me  23:45, 17 November 2022 (UTC)
 * Draft seems fine. Only the poster was released, hardly notable at this point. Oaktree b (talk) 23:51, 17 November 2022 (UTC)
 * Draftify and throw a Film draft notice on it. Revisit when evidence of principal photography and such is going. Leave a redirect to the director. AngusW🐶🐶F  ( bark  •  sniff ) 00:10, 18 November 2022 (UTC)


 * Why this page is being deleted? adding information is not a crime. More over the films production is started and its confirmed by the lead actor in his tweet
 * https://twitter.com/Karthi_Offl/status/1592119314374885378?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw SarkarVijay (talk) 18:15, 18 November 2022 (UTC)
 * It's being discussed for deletion as there are little to no sources we can use. A tweet isn't enough to keep an article. We need sourcing in newspaper articles or the like. Oaktree b (talk) 17:32, 19 November 2022 (UTC)

Reference - https://www.mathrubhumi.com/movies-music/news/karthi-new-movie-japan-filming-started-anu-emmanuel-and-raju-murugan-1.8028705 Jehowahyereh (talk) 02:00, 18 November 2022 (UTC)
 * Keep : Shooting already started on November 12th in Thoothukoodi as per mathrubhumi news article and I have referenced that and it definetly passes Notability for films with lot of reference which are reliable, secondary and independend. I don't know why someone among who tried to remove the article removed the Times of India article as well. Attaching the reference from mathrubhumi.


 * Per Wikipedia guidelines for future films WP:NFF, "Additionally, films that have already begun shooting, but have not yet been publicly released (theatres or video), should generally not have their own articles unless the production itself is notable per the notability guidelines."
 * Please explain why you think the production so far has been notable when the only links provided so far have just said filming has begun. Donald D23   talk to me  02:13, 18 November 2022 (UTC)


 * Draftify. Per WP:NFF, Additionally, films that have already begun shooting, but have not yet been publicly released (theatres or video), should generally not have their own articles unless the production itself is notable per the notability guidelines. Similarly, films produced in the past which were either not completed or not distributed should not have their own articles, unless their failure was notable per the guidelines. WP:GNG states that not all coverage in reliable sources constitutes evidence of notability for the purposes of article creation, including minor announcements. In this case, the references, while some are WP:RS, almost all announce that production has begun or a poster, that fails WP:SIGCOV. As such, with WP:GNG or WP:NFILM failed IMO drafting this is a good option.  VickKiang  (talk)  05:40, 18 November 2022 (UTC)


 * Times of India is not a reliable source per WP:RSP. Already told you that on the talk page. AngusW🐶🐶F  ( bark  •  sniff ) 06:40, 18 November 2022 (UTC)


 * Comment : Initially the AFD nominators concern was that the principal photography has not started so the page need to be removed, when I provided the evidence about filming commenced on November 12, the concern changed to production not notable. Here is the evidence to prove the production is notable. Every one in this film production are very much notable Directed and written by Raju Murugan, Produced by	S. R. Prabhu, Starring	Karthi - Its a prominent film in Karthi's career as its his 25th film, Anu Emmanuel, Sunil, Vijay Milton, Cinematography	by Ravi Varman, Music by G. V. Prakash Kumar and Production company Dream Warrior Pictures.

Someone who commented above said Times of India is not reliable as per WP:RSP, but we can clearly see that its a NO CONSEUS and thus no one can say its not reliable. Jehowahyereh (talk) 13:37, 18 November 2022 (UTC)


 * The film is officially started into production and this page should not be deleted SarkarVijay (talk) 18:12, 18 November 2022 (UTC)
 * Per Wikipedia guidelines for future films WP:NFF, "Additionally, films that have already begun shooting, but have not yet been publicly released (theatres or video), should generally not have their own articles unless the production itself is notable per the notability guidelines."
 * Please explain why you think the production so far has been notable. Donald D23   talk to me  00:36, 19 November 2022 (UTC)
 * No, it says the Times is between unreliable and no consensus, we can't use it as a reliable source. Oaktree b (talk) 22:51, 19 November 2022 (UTC)

Here is what Times Now says about Japan Movie It has definitely set a new bar in the entertainment industry. Even top news papers are telling like this which means its clearly a notable production. Jehowahyereh (talk) 13:50, 18 November 2022 (UTC)

Times Now reference : https://www.timesnownews.com/entertainment-news/japan-first-look-out-actor-karthi-in-quirky-avatar-in-his-25th-film-fans-say-rocket-raja-returns-article-95513843 Jehowahyereh (talk) 15:15, 18 November 2022 (UTC)


 * Article is about the actor, with the film mentioned in it. Does not help notability of the film. Donald D23   talk to me  17:29, 18 November 2022 (UTC)
 * A film doesn't inherit notability because that the directors, actors, and producers are notable.  VickKiang  (talk)  20:32, 18 November 2022 (UTC)


 * Draftify: as most of the users said above. ​​​​​​​𝐋𝐨𝐫𝐝𝐕𝐨𝐥𝐝𝐞𝐦𝐨𝐫𝐭𝟕𝟐𝟖🧙‍♂️ 18:03, 18 November 2022 (UTC)
 * COMMENT : As per the inclusion criteria of films - 2nd point The film features significant involvement (i.e., one of the most important roles in the making of the film) by a notable person and is a major part of their career it is proved that the movie is notable as its Karthi's milestone movie being it his 25th movie as reported by lot of news media as referenced in the article. Also its is filmmaker Vijay Milton debut as an actor which was featured by News18, Indiagitz etc . Also its heroine Anu Emmanuel's second big film in her career as per news reports. Thus this movie is  is proved notable. Jehowahyereh (talk) 13:29, 20 November 2022 (UTC)
 * So, what is wrong with it being DRAFTED until release? Donald D23   talk to me  17:30, 20 November 2022 (UTC)
 * So, what is wrong with it being live, else you may try to draftying all movies in the upcoming movie list ? I have made my point Jehowahyereh (talk) 04:53, 21 November 2022 (UTC)
 * WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS.  VickKiang  (talk)  05:32, 21 November 2022 (UTC)
 * Because we follow policies and procedures on Wikipedia, not emotions. Donald D23   talk to me  14:57, 21 November 2022 (UTC)
 * Draftify: Not enough sources. Kailash29792 (talk)  07:35, 21 November 2022 (UTC)
 * Note to closer: Ignore the WP:CANVASsing by — DaxServer (t · m · c) 09:33, 21 November 2022 (UTC)
 * I've added a not a vote template, IMO that's sufficient.  VickKiang  (talk)  09:45, 21 November 2022 (UTC)


 * Comment : Its not any sought of canvassing, I just asked few to post what they feel about the AFD discussion. I have not asked anyone to do Keep Votes instead asked them to post their genuine feedback. Then what is the problem ? Even one person I message added a Draftify as well. I wanted people who know about Tamil movies make comments or votes rather than who just don't know about it. Jehowahyereh (talk) 10:00, 21 November 2022 (UTC)
 * Perhaps you should read WP:CANVASS again. The audience must not be selected on the basis of their opinions—for example, if notices are sent to editors who previously supported deleting an article, then identical notices should be sent to those who supported keeping it. Do not send notices that violate WP:INAPPNOTE, and do not send messages to users who have asked not to receive them. You deliberately selected a specific audience, and suggested in your messages that other voters (presumably including me) fail to understand Tamil movies, which is a violation of the neutral message: Posting a notification of discussion that presents the topic in a non-neutral manner, you clearly introduced only your opinion.  VickKiang  (talk)  10:05, 21 November 2022 (UTC)
 * I have read it many times previously as well. I have been neutral in my point of view and in the message I send. I have asked them to post whatever they feel about it. Not any Keep or Not any delete, what ever they feel they may post and I was not specific and thus I was very much neutral. If not why would one among them already posted to Draftify the article ??? Jehowahyereh (talk) 10:17, 21 November 2022 (UTC)
 * neutral? I'll post one of your message here for other users to opine:
 * Hi S Abhiram, I hope you will be interested in editing film related wiki pages. I want you to take part in an AFD discussion of the Karthi's new movie Japan. I think AFD is being created by some foreigners who don't know much about Indian Films. Being an Indian I feel that you will understand more and point out your genuine opininion whatever it be in the AFD . Here is the link - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Japan_(2023_film)
 * I think AFD is being created by some foreigners who don't know much about Indian Films. Being an Indian I feel that you will understand more and point out your genuine opininion whatever it be in the AFD. There is no guideline that states that users who are supposedly "foreigners" don't know much about Indian films to participate in those AfDs, and this is a biased notification.  VickKiang  (talk)  10:19, 21 November 2022 (UTC)
 * The post by user Jehowahyereh on the other users page, that is copied above, is the definition of canvassing. Donald D23   talk to me  19:45, 21 November 2022 (UTC)
 * Comment : Added 2 references, one from ETimes justifying that the production is notable and one from Malayala Manorama justifying the point as per the inclusion criteria of films - 2nd point The film features significant involvement (i.e., one of the most important roles in the making of the film) by a notable person and is a major part of their career - Milestone movie in Karthi's career Jehowahyereh (talk) 16:48, 24 November 2022 (UTC)
 * Meeting the inclusionary criteria would require numerous WP:RS to state that it is a major part of their career, not merely your opinion coupled with routine announcements and marginally reliable sources (e.g., The Times of India).  VickKiang  (talk)  20:33, 24 November 2022 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.