Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Javi du art


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. Consensus is that the article currently fails the notability guidelines Davewild (talk) 18:25, 15 May 2015 (UTC)

Javi du art

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Non-notable artist. Duarte has been the subject of some local coverage for having exhibited at a local art festival. But the coverage is all local; nothing beyond his hometown of Palm Beach or his college newspaper. Duarte may become a well-known artist, but not yet. WikiDan61 ChatMe!ReadMe!! 17:48, 7 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Delete When I pulled the speedy off, I thought he was the youngest at any Art Palm Beach, which was enough- youngest at 2015 Art Palm Beach isn't so good. Falls under WP:TOOSOON I feel. Joseph2302 (talk) 17:51, 7 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Weak Keep Even though coverage is local, artist was the primary subject in at least one of the articles (e.g. not mentioned in passing with the art festival as the primary focus, etc).  Chris  lk02  Chris Kreider 18:07, 7 May 2015 (UTC)

Hello, guys. Art Palm Beach is not a 'local art show' as you suggest. Simply because the show is located in du art's hometown it does not equate to a small, local show. As I have stated previously, the show exhibits galleries from around the world ranging from Los Angeles, New York, Berlin, London and Hong Kong, among others. He is in fact the youngest artist in the 18 years that Art Palm Beach has been showing. The media has unfortunately misinformed the audience about his accomplishments. I have emailed Jan Engoren, the writer from the Sun Sentinel, to revise the article so the quotation by Rolando Chang Barrero is corrected. I will come back to this post with the link to the updated article as soon as I have a response. Thank you.

Jonnyplaxo (talk) 21:16, 7 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Comment Whether or not the comment is corrected, the significance of the Art Palm Beach show is not established by any reliable sources so du art's showing there has no verifiable significance. The fact that the show exhibits galleries around the world may simply mean that galleries around the world wish to sell their art to the well-heeled Palm Beach residents. But there is no indication that this show has any particular standard for accepting any particular art. It may well, but we have no way of knowing without a reliable source. WikiDan61 ChatMe!ReadMe!! 21:26, 7 May 2015 (UTC)


 * Delete - even the Sun Sentinel ref headlines with the fact that he has only just sold his first piece of art - dated 2015 and presumably from other clues, that is April 2015 - not yet a month old! Sorry but this is way too soon  Velella  Velella Talk 21:28, 7 May 2015 (UTC)

WikiDan, I say this with all due respect, but your unknown assumptions toward events that do not have an internet presence is quite skewed, particularly on Wikipedia, which relies solely on factual information. At first, you were saying that javi du art was "not notable enough", after I mentioned that the reliable source would be corrected you attempted to find another method of disallowing for the article to be published. Last year, Art Palm Beach had a film screening of Ai Weiwei’s "Pull of the Moon". Perhaps one of the most renown Asian artists in contemporary art. http://artpalmbeach.com/fair_events/ Please also note that there were countless works by Pablo Picasso, Salvador Dali, Andy Warhol among many others. http://artpalmbeach.com/modern-masters-at-apb/

Leonardo DiCaprio and Larry Gagosian were also seen at the event. So please understand that this is an event with utmost significance.

Jonnyplaxo (talk) 00:22, 8 May 2015 (UTC)

I may also add that as an official dealer and representative of du art, his work was collected by a New York collector - who chooses to remain private - at his "Prodigy and A Master" exhibition on April 23rd, 2015. After this event, there are multiple collectors who are seeking to purchase more of his work. Yes, he is emerging, but he has already accomplished an incredible feat. His accomplishments should be allowed to be shared freely with others. Jonnyplaxo (talk) 00:33, 8 May 2015 (UTC)
 * This issue at hand here is wikipedia had notability guidelines. There are many MANY artists that fall below this threshold, and this artist is admittedly new the scene compared to most of the artists that have articles here on Wikipedia (why wikidan cited WP:TOOSOON I suspect).  At the end of the day, we need a reliable source to back up notability claims, we are an encyclopedia, not an modern date art collector.  Do you have any good references in news papers, interviews, articles, websites, anything that we can use as a citation?  That would go a LONG ways.  If you have something like that, I would even be willing to try and help clean the article up a bit.  Chris  lk02  Chris Kreider 00:39, 8 May 2015 (UTC)


 * Comment As an "official dealer and representative of du art" you should familiarize yourself with Wikipedia's conflict of interest policy. Your purpose in creating this article (presumably to promote your client) does not mesh with Wikipedia's purpose of presenting a neutral presentation of notable and verifiable facts.  WikiDan61 ChatMe!ReadMe!! 01:04, 8 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Visual arts-related deletion discussions. North America1000 01:12, 8 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of People-related deletion discussions. North America1000 01:13, 8 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Florida-related deletion discussions. North America1000 01:13, 8 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Colombia-related deletion discussions. North America1000 01:13, 8 May 2015 (UTC)

But that's the thing, WakiDan, you continue to assume without any preconceived and concrete facts. It is evident that these posts illustrate that your 'power' to add and delete articles with ease has overtaken you. I'll just have to wait a few more weeks, no big deal. Please learn from Chrislk02's response on how to properly approach someone online using a neutral point of view rather than being quick to dash out and offend (which i was just a tiny bit) others online.

i just have one question, how does the artist Kadar Brock have a wikipeadia article? I find this quite saddening.

98.211.135.110 (talk) 02:01, 8 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Comment  I presume the IP edit reflect a failure to login. The thing is, we don't create Wikipedia article before the sources are available. We wait until the sources are available and then we write the article based on those sources. Since there are no reliable sources for this artist, there is no basis for an article. And for the record, I have no "power" to delete article with ease. I have brought this article to AFD so the community can decide. I'll stand by whatever decision the community comes to.  WikiDan61 ChatMe!ReadMe!! 03:47, 8 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Comment P.S. The existence of other bad articles is a bad argument for the retention of this article. But thanks for pointing that article out.  WikiDan61 ChatMe!ReadMe!! 03:52, 8 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Delete Falls some way short of notability. Exhibiting at this fair does not go far, nor a news story centred on his age not his art. Creator seems to have WP:COI issues on his own admission. Johnbod (talk) 17:40, 8 May 2015 (UTC)


 * Update The article has been corrected to reflect du art’s accomplishments, the author has apologized for the error. http://www.sun-sentinel.com/local/palm-beach/boynton-beach/fl-bbf-bbad-0506-20150506-story.html

Now, the issue stands with the lack of credibility of Art Palm Beach. Please take a look at the following state and national publications that relate to and praise the fair’s rapid growth. This article by ArtPrice states the attendance record of approximately 28,000 people from around the world who attended in 2012. http://www.artprice.com/events/74077/ArtPalmBeach

In addition, please note the following articles and publications:


 * ArtForbes http://www.artforbes.com/art-fairsagenda.html
 * Art&Culture http://104.131.55.21/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/artcultureapb.pdf
 * MetroCitizen http://www.metrocitizen.net/art-palm-beach-2013/
 * EYES IN Magazine http://www.eyesin.com/article/art-design/photography/artpalmbeach-featuring-artists-like-drew-tal/
 * Highlights a gallery exhibiting work by the Lino Tagliapietra, one of the world’s most accomplished glass artist. http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/entertainment/artpalmbeach-2013-a-contemporary-showcase/nT2H9/

These are just a few well-established online platforms that exemplify the notability of Art Palm Beach.

I will gladly take the time to update Art Palm Beach to take note of it’s actual credibility. I agree 100% that its Wikipedia Article does not appear to be enough to support the artist’s claim that this is indeed a notable accomplishment. I will gladly contribute to the article to justify.

Thank you

Jonnyplaxo (talk) 20:52, 8 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Comment This discussion isn't actually about the notability of Art Palm Beach, it's about the notability of javi du art, and nothing has yet been proposed to change that. No coverage of du art in any reliable sources. However, since du art's exhibiting at Art Palm Beach is being used as an argument for his supposed notability, I have to say that none of the sources provided by Jonnyplaxo really bolster the notability of that show. They are all basically event notices: the show exists, and it takes place in Palm Beach. They don't argue for the show's notability, and they don't argue for du art's notability for having exhibited in it.  WikiDan61 ChatMe!ReadMe!! 21:44, 8 May 2015 (UTC)


 * Comment Initially you were questioning the artist's notability. As a result, I stated that the Sun-Sentinel's author would correct the article so it expresses the correct information. After this, you questioned Art Palm Beach's notability. I then sent the updated article which clearly states a remarkable feat by the young artist, along with reputable local and national sources that state the caliber of the international fair. Now you are regressing to what you previously stated, questioning the artist's notability. After I have responded to your valid arguments with credible sources, there still seems to be hesitation. You continue to go back and forth with your statements that I have lost your reason for justification for the deletion of this article. I will await other's responses.

Jonnyplaxo (talk) 22:02, 8 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Comment No, I haven't "gone back and forth". The point of the discussion at hand is whether javi du art is notable enough to be included in Wikipedia. There are very clear guidelines as to what should be covered (see WP:ARTIST, WP:ANYBIO and WP:GNG). du art meets none of these criteria. Artist might be notable if they have exhibited at a major show (something like the Vienna Biennale). So, since du art has exhibited at Art Palm Beach, we need to evaluate whether that is a major show on the order of the Vienna Biennale. The sources provided do not indicate that it is such. So we are left with an artist who doesn't meet the criteria, because the one show he has exhibited at does not meet the criteria. Done and done. I've said enough at this point. I'll leave the discussion to others.  WikiDan61 ChatMe!ReadMe!! 01:50, 9 May 2015 (UTC)


 * Comment There is clearly a great deal of perplexity from your part. Simply read this article. http://www.artnews.com/2015/03/25/heres-the-artist-list-for-the-first-vienna-biennale/ There is zero comparison between the Vienna Biennale and Art Palm Beach: 1 year versus 18 years. I need not say more.

Please read my comment where it states the national sources that indicate Art Palm Beach's caliber. Need not reply. Thank you.

Jonnyplaxo (talk) 02:11, 9 May 2015 (UTC)
 * I misspoke myself: I meant the Venice Biennale. WikiDan61 ChatMe!ReadMe!! 03:51, 9 May 2015 (UTC)


 * Delete. A textbook case of WP:TOOSOON and trying to build notability with a Wikipedia article. This does not satisfy WP:GNG or WP:ARTIST. If and when multiple, non-trivial sources become available the article can be recreated. It's not Wikipedia's responsibility to introduce an artist.  freshacconci  talk to me  16:08, 12 May 2015 (UTC)


 * Comment The artist's intention is not to build notability through Wikipedia. If he had not accomplished anything then I'd agree with your statement. At his young age, it is easy to misinterpret the reasoning for his inclusion on Wikipedia. I have illustrated multiple sources that mention both Art Palm Beach and du art's notability. Wikipedia is certainly not introducing the artist, he has won multiple state and national merit-based awards but unfortunately most art-oriented organizations do not have an online presence. He received a full-tuition scholarship from The Caridad Center http://www.caridad.org/education/ and an additional grand-prize award for artist merit from http://CreateRealimpact.com

It is evident that the artist's participation in this significant exhibition suffices Wikipedia's guidelines for the inclusion of the article. Thank you

Jonnyplaxo (talk) 15:22, 14 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Unfortunately, you have not understood Wikipedia's guidelines. Winning scholarships is wonderful for a student but does not make one notable. None of the awards mentioned are major awards and the sources given are not sufficient to satisfy WP:GNG. Exhibiting at Art Palm Beach is not in itself notable as it is not curated but rather pay-to-display (the application process does not include selection criteria but rather just a deposit). It is likely that in a few years an article can be written but per WP:CRYSTALBALL we can't write articles based on possible future notability.  freshacconci  talk to me  16:52, 14 May 2015 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.