Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/John Webster (organist)


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep‎__EXPECTED_UNCONNECTED_PAGE__. (non-admin closure) Enos733 (talk) 18:54, 25 May 2023 (UTC)

John Webster (organist)

 * – ( View AfD View log | edits since nomination)

Not a notable person. According to Discogs, his most notable album have a total of 21 listeners. He has published a total of 4 albums, which is not notable for a music artist. Sources are also not reliable. A simple Google search shows nothing related to the organist. Fails WP:GNG. Hadal1337 (talk) 16:27, 18 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Academics and educators, Bands and musicians,  and England. Hey man im josh (talk) 16:41, 18 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Keep, (1) we could probably just about stretch to his inclusion under NPROF given that he was an academic musician who held the post of University Organist in a prestigious institution (Oxford), as well as being professor of organ at Trinity College, one of the most significant musical establishments in the UK; these are heavyweight positions at least as significant as many named/endowed professorships, which are deemed indicators of notability; (2) the whole concept of "discogs" and "albums" doesn't make any sense in assessing an organist who died in 1974. He was seven before commercial radio broadcasts began. He was already 47 before the cassette player hit the market. Much of his musical career was carved out in an era when people listened to real musicians, and recordings were rare and extremely expensive. The recordings he made will be on vinyl, not digital media. We have no idea how many people listened to those recordings. Overall, if he was notable back then (which I believe he was) he still is now. But fundamentally (3) we owe it to our readers to satisfy their curiosity about such historical figures, who did interesting things like play for the wedding of Harold Wilson. Elemimele (talk) 21:47, 18 May 2023 (UTC)
 * (1) If we were to stretch his inclusion under NPROF, then could you please find me some papers he published? Because I am unable to.
 * (2) You make a valid point regarding discogs, however, do you think a music artist who published a total of 4 albums is considered as notable? Unless I am missing some of his albums, please feel free to enlighten me. Also, like you said, we have no idea how many people listened to his recordings, if so, how did you come to the conclusion that he was notable back then without any source?
 * (3) While satisfying readers' curiosity about historical figures who have done interesting things is a valid consideration, it is crucial to maintain a consistent approach to assessing notability. The inclusion of an individual based solely on their historical significance, without considering the established criteria for notability, may compromise the credibility and integrity of the selection process. Hadal1337 (talk) 08:34, 19 May 2023 (UTC)
 * I didn't make myself clear: he might satisfy criterion 5 of WP:NPROF, holder of a distinguished chair or equivalent in a prestigious institution. This does not require academic publications. (2) the number of albums someone produced must be considered in the light of when they worked and the genre they produced; for an organist to get recorded at all in the period 1914-1974 might be a rather more than average achievement - I'm not sure, and would value a more knowledgeable opinion. Elemimele (talk) 10:59, 20 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Actually, this is quite amusing and unique: We know that coverage of him exists in newspapers because Harold Wilson's wife compiled a scrapbook "mainly comprising newspaper cuttings with reviews of his concerts and recordings (some of which were recorded on the organ of University College)." In effect, Mrs Wilson has done the BEFORE for us... Elemimele (talk) 11:11, 20 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Keep – per above – full professor at a leading music college and a scrapbook of newspaper cuttings available in a reputable archive, collected by Mary Wilson, Baroness Wilson of Rievaulx, poet and wife of former British Prime Minister Harold Wilson. —Jonathan Bowen (talk) 15:35, 22 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Keep per above discussion. Being a distinguished professor at a prestigious university does not require proof of numbers of citations for the PROF test. Bearian (talk) 17:55, 23 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Keep per above. The person who loves reading (talk) 02:02, 25 May 2023 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.