Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Joris Bert


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was Keep. czar ⨹   02:26, 3 December 2014 (UTC)

Joris Bert

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Non notable baseball player.. He washed out of the U.S. leagues after 2 seasons in the Gulf Coast League. He did play with the France national baseball team in some European tournaments, but the quality of play there is not good and I wouldn't consider any of the European tournaments to be "major international competitions." I can see a small amount of coverage but not enough in my opinion. Spanneraol (talk) 19:56, 20 November 2014 (UTC) I'm going to withdraw this nomination on the basis of having been convinved by the arguments below and the preponderances of keep votes. Spanneraol (talk) 00:01, 2 December 2014 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Baseball-related deletion discussions. Spanneraol (talk) 19:57, 20 November 2014 (UTC)


 * Comment That is a nice little piece by the paper of record, though. A bullpen catcher got kept for one SB Nation blog piece. GNG aside for now, BASE/N #2 says "...major international competition (such as the World Baseball Classic, Baseball World Cup or Olympics) as a member of a national team." So, as it's written, being on a national team isn't enough. You have to play in a major tournament on that team. So the questions are (1) is the European Baseball Championship a "major tournament" for our definitions, and (2) what is " the Beijing tournament from 15 to 24 August 2007" referring to? – Muboshgu (talk) 20:16, 20 November 2014 (UTC)
 * The Beijing tournament was apparently something called the "Good Luck Beijing International baseball tournament".. which certainly doesnt seem like a major tournament. Spanneraol (talk) 05:14, 21 November 2014 (UTC)


 * Delete Fails GNG. The European Baseball Championship isn't a major tournament by any definition relevant to Wikipedia. - Bbny-wiki-editor (talk) 20:50, 20 November 2014 (UTC)
 * Comment He's a former minor-league player in the US, is that not notable enough? He should also be notable for being the first French player drafted in the US. Oaktree b (talk) 21:09, 20 November 2014 (UTC)
 * Being a former minor league player is not notable enough, no. Especially since he only played in the rookie leagues.Spanneraol (talk) 21:38, 20 November 2014 (UTC)


 * Keep The tournaments he played in are notable enough for this editor, so in my view he passes WP:BASE/N. Probably covered in quite a few articles, too. I'll check on that later. Alex (talk) 23:20, 20 November 2014 (UTC)


 * Wow, so every player from the European Baseball Championship now qualifies for a Wiki page? Wikipedia's biggest troll just keeps on trolling. - Bbny-wiki-editor (talk) 02:57, 21 November 2014 (UTC)
 * BBNY, it's clear your life sucks, that's why you have to act so angry all the time on WIKIPEDIA of all places. Yes, I think the European Championship qualifies as a notable international tournament, I was not aware I was obligated to think in lockstep with Bbny-wiki-editor and the cabal of obnoxious baseball editors. You're so mad. It's pathetic. Leave the Internet for a while, for your own good. Alex (talk) 04:54, 21 November 2014 (UTC)
 * Comment The only thing I'm angry about is the massive amount of time you cause people to waste here. Just in the past couple of weeks, you wasted hours of people's time with the bullpen catcher stupidity, and then you nominated 30 lists of minor league players for deletion just for kicks, and now you're making up new BASE/N standards out of thin air. You're an obnoxious troll and Wikipedia would be far better off without you. It's an embarrassment to the community that no administrative action has been taken against you. - Bbny-wiki-editor (talk) 05:00, 21 November 2014 (UTC)
 * BBNY when people don't do exactly as he wants Bbny, what is it exactly that you contribute to this site, besides constantly talking people down? (And hey, guess who won the bullpen catcher battle? Not you. LOL.) Alex (talk) 05:06, 21 November 2014 (UTC)


 * I didn't win the bullpen catcher battle? At last count, the notability discussion was 18-0 in favor of my position, which is that bullpen catchers aren't coaches and must pass GNG. - Bbny-wiki-editor (talk) 05:50, 21 November 2014 (UTC)


 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of France-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 18:36, 21 November 2014 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of United States of America-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 18:37, 21 November 2014 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Sportspeople-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 18:37, 21 November 2014 (UTC)


 * Comment Okay, sources. You say sources are sparse? I say otherwise. Right on Google's first page of returns for "Joris Bert," we get this full-length, New York Times feature article, he earned this mention on Mister-Baseball, considered one of the top sites for European baseball coverage. He earned mention in the book Baseball in Europe. He earned this full article from France's journal Liberation. Then there's this article from 'Le Parisien. And there's this. And this. These were all found within the first few pages of Google (the English one, no less!). And there's other stuff out there...French, Dutch, British, American. This guy earned international coverage. Alex (talk) 08:01, 23 November 2014 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Europe-related deletion discussions. Alex (talk) 08:07, 23 November 2014 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Texas-related deletion discussions. Alex (talk) 08:07, 23 November 2014 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of California-related deletion discussions. Alex (talk) 08:07, 23 November 2014 (UTC)


 * Keep. Whatever the status or quality of European baseball (which I would hope would be about on the level of rounders), this individual gets enough dedicated coverage in the French press to pass the general notability guideline. I know this because I clicked on the "Find sources" link above. --Andreas Philopater (talk) 21:48, 26 November 2014 (UTC)
 * Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.


 * Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, NorthAmerica1000 22:02, 27 November 2014 (UTC)


 * Keep 99.9% of minor league baseball players are not notable. The very rare ones who are the subject of coverage like an 18 paragraph article in the New York Times and a detailed profile in Liberation are notable. He is a rarity - a serious French baseball player drafted by an American team. Notability guidelines are guidelines, after all. They are not chiseled in stone. Cullen328  Let's discuss it  05:00, 28 November 2014 (UTC)
 * "Notability guidelines are guidelines, after all. They are not chiseled in stone." That's what I'm sayin'! Alex (talk) 05:44, 28 November 2014 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.