Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Kesari Tours


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete.  Sandstein  09:41, 18 November 2017 (UTC)

Kesari Tours

 * – ( View AfD View log  Stats )

Based entirely upon notices and promotional articles. It is highly misleading to say it won the national tourism award: there are 37 categories each year, some with multiple divisions-- and it won in only one of them. ..  DGG ( talk ) 04:51, 4 November 2017 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Companies-related deletion discussions. North America1000 08:17, 4 November 2017 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of India-related deletion discussions. North America1000 08:17, 4 November 2017 (UTC)


 * Delete- per nom. Smallbones( smalltalk ) 04:38, 8 November 2017 (UTC)


 * KEEP : Mr. DGG, You are actually misleading here voters by calling it misleading. The company has received the National Tourism Award twice. The prestigious award is given by Ministry of Tourism (India), Government of India. The award is present by The President of India, but sometimes by Minister of Tourism or Honorable Loksabha speaker. (You may google about National Tourism Awards)

Kesari Tours was aslo awarded the Best Outbound Tour Operator for the year 2011-12 by Maharashtra Tourism Development Corporation, Government of Maharashtra. Apart by awards and recognition from Government, the company has received several corporate award. It clearly meets Wikipedia's notability guidelines.

Here is the complete list of awards,


 * The Brand of the Year award 2017, by World Consulting & Research Corporation (WCRC)


 * National Tourism Awards 2014-15, by the Ministry of Tourism, Government of India, bestowed by Pranab Mukherjee, the President of India.


 * National Tourism Awards 2013-14, by the Ministry of Tourism, Government of India (http://pib.nic.in/newsite/PrintRelease.aspx?relid=127016)


 * Best Corporate Incentive Tour Operator 2015, by India Travel Awards


 * Best MICE Operator by India Travel Awards


 * Best Outbound Tour Operator for the year 2011-12 by Maharashtra Tourism Development Corporation, Government of Maharashtra


 * Abacus International Award 2007

What more you want? Please note article has been approved by Article for Creation. I request voters to please check and verify the facts and recognition Kesari has received. Do not blindly vote. The article is enough notable to meet the Wikipedia guidelines.--49.35.14.20 (talk) 03:44, 9 November 2017 (UTC)


 * As I said, it did not receive the national tourist award. I checked these in detail before I made the nomination, because of my experience with similarly promotional articles in this and other industries. Just for the national tourist awards itself, there are 59 different categories of awards each year. One year it won 2 out of the 59, the other year 1. Looking at the other awards listed, most similarly come in various categories or specifications. They are in a single one out of multiple categories, or a single one out of multiple states.  They are all furthermore for one or two years out of many--the normal practice in industries such as this is to have things work out so that every large firm wins some awards.  It's the   structure of any industry which depends on promotionalism and advertising that there be prizes for everyone.   The way they have been listed here is deceptive, and the fact that they are being listed deceptively is one of the indications of promotionalism. Promotionalism and PR rely on such methods; but we are an encyclopedia, and that does not work here.   Businesses promote themselves   according to their  standards, and we write an encyclopedia according to ours. I am not blaming you personally--if I were writing advertising, I would write it as you do.  DGG ( talk ) 06:10, 9 November 2017 (UTC)
 * agree with DGG - these awards and the way that they are presented are actually reasons *not* to have the article on an encyclopedia. Smallbones( smalltalk ) 18:31, 10 November 2017 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks,  Sandstein   09:36, 11 November 2017 (UTC)
 * Delete as non notable tour company, No evidence to establish notability, Fails GNG. – Davey 2010 Talk 13:04, 11 November 2017 (UTC)
 * Delete there is reasonable argument above and further highlight the importance of why Wikipedia policies/guidelines(or RULES) are not rigid. The company did indeed received an award but didn't meet WP:CORP nor WP:GNG as there's no significant, sustained coverage of the company in details. Thus the attempt to use only awards to argue its keeping is evidence that there is no significant coverage as the company is not notable thus the award perfectly serves as reason not have the article as reasoned above. Wikipedia is not place to display awards received by company.  &thinsp;&mdash; Ammarpad (talk)
 * Delete: I reinstated the 2009 TravelBiz Monitor item which had been a reference in an early draft of this article, as it is probably the most substantial coverage. However neither it nor the various trade awards seem to me to be sufficient evidence that this is more than a company going about its business and is of encyclopaedic notability. AllyD (talk) 08:24, 16 November 2017 (UTC)
 * Delete As per nom, references fail the criteria for establishing notability, fails WP:NCORP. -- HighKing ++ 17:13, 16 November 2017 (UTC)


 * Comment : Mr., You said that Kesari did not receive such award, which is totally misleading and false statement made by you. Again I'm saying that Kesari has received the National Tourism Award (by the Ministry of Tourism (India), Government of India.) Though given reference is verifiable but still if you want, I can send you the images of the award certificate, trophy and award events pictures. I would request you to provide your Email address.

If a 33 years old company with the company has no importance if the company is not doing well in his respective field. Why would the Government of India and the Government of Maharashtra or any Indian Ministry recognise the company? Why would they award the company?

Request you to kindly be considerate and understand the fact that the article is not resorting to any kind of advertising and promotions. Not a single word of the article is sounding promotional as per guidelines. complying the Wikipedia guidelines, the article was submitted for Article for creation, and it was approved from there just because it was notable and complies the Wikipedia guidelines.

I request to Mr. who accepted the article under AFC, to check that does he also think that the article is not notable. --2405:204:9116:20A0:C6DA:6B67:F8A0:621C (talk) 11:50, 17 November 2017 (UTC)
 * " Why would the Government of India and the Government of Maharashtra or any Indian Ministry recognise the company? Why would they award the company?" Because it is the purpose of the relevant government agencies to promote tourism, and they will therefor cooperate with any legitimate tourist related business, not just the notable ones. Among the ways they cooperate is by issuing awards to all of them in turn, in as impressive a manner as they can arrange.  Not every legitimate business is notable, in this or any field.  I could equally ask why the company would want a WP article, and again, it is in order to promote their business. But we have a different purpose than the Ministry of Tourism.  Passing AfC means that the reviewer thinks it likely to pass AfD., not that they think it is certain to pas AfD. No reviewer is always right about their prediction. The test is whether it does in fact pass AfD, where multiple people discus it.  DGG ( talk ) 17:26, 17 November 2017 (UTC)


 * Delete You know what, this is a good try, but after a second look, taking into account the concerns of DGG and editors above, the sources are not adequate. For the IP above, I will list the sources and their issues:
 * -- not an independent source. Written by the founder of the company.
 * -- the subject is not focused on just Kesari, there are two companies spoken about here, and therefore Kesari is not the exclusive subject of the reference.
 * -- press release. Fails WP:CORPDEPTH.
 * -- this source is good, if it wasn't overly promotional.
 * -- fails WP:CORPDEPTH. Just a mention of the company.
 * -- fails WP:CORPDEPTH. Routine company profile.
 * -- the subject of the reference weaves between the founder and the company itself.
 * As I said above, this is a good try, but the references used are not solid. Disagreements happen all the time in any place, and what one might say 'yes' to, another might say 'no'. I've gone back and reviewed my position, and it is clear that I did not thoroughly consider the appropriateness of the sources, or, in short: I'm wrong. My name is not dave (talk/contribs) 12:34, 17 November 2017 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.