Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Kevin Xu (2nd nomination)


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was no consensus‎__EXPECTED_UNCONNECTED_PAGE__. This discussion is badly fractured and establishing a consensus here is very difficult. Additionally to this, the article has been changed somewhat significantly during the discussion (not necessarily a bad thing, especially where it incorporates some of the new information found). No prejudice towards a renomination should someone wish to do so. Daniel (talk) 05:08, 2 December 2023 (UTC)

Kevin Xu
AfDs for this article:


 * – ( View AfD View log | edits since nomination)

The reference to the subject does not satisfy the notability guidelines. Clearly failing WP:GNG, as well as failing WP:NBIO. Bimanmandal (talk) 20:01, 17 November 2023 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Businesspeople-related deletion discussions. Bimanmandal (talk) 20:01, 17 November 2023 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Medicine, China,  and California.  WC  Quidditch   ☎   ✎  20:26, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

Voxl (talk) 20:52, 21 November 2023 (UTC)
 * Delete per nom. Seems to be a promotional article for the person. --Kammerer55 (talk) 16:44, 20 November 2023 (UTC)
 * Delete as this article does not appear to have improved since it was previously deleted in 2017, relying mainly on non-independent sources, including many articles authored by the subject. Search of Newspapers.com turns up exactly one article in The Los Angeles Times which details a lawsuit against him along with other owner(s) of LA Weekly. Does not meet WP:GNG. Cielquiparle (talk) 02:16, 21 November 2023 (UTC)
 * The Kevin Xu mentioned in this newspaper article is not the same individual as the Kevin Xu referred to in the main article; they merely share the same name. Please stick to the facts.
 * It definitely is the same Kevin Xu. The LA Times article mentions him as the CEO of Mebo International. The Lux Magazine article (among others) discusses his co-ownership of LA Weekly. Cielquiparle (talk) 23:39, 21 November 2023 (UTC)

 Keep the "Kevin Xu" Article 
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Businesspeople-related deletion discussions. Cielquiparle (talk) 00:00, 22 November 2023 (UTC)

The "Kevin Xu" article should be retained as it meets Wikipedia's notability guidelines with significant coverage in independent, reliable sources. These sources detail his notable impact and achievements. Additionally, if the article is kept, I recommend incorporating information about any controversies or disputes involving this individual, ensuring a more comprehensive and balanced representation of the subject.

--Loving This Mayweather (talk) 00:58, 23 November 2023 (UTC) Sock vote struck.--Bbb23 (talk) 14:51, 24 November 2023 (UTC)

Keep per the significant coverage in multiple independent reliable sources. The subject passes Notability (people), which says: "People are presumed if they have received significant coverage in  that are,  of each other, and .If the depth of coverage in any given source is not substantial, then multiple independent sources may be combined to demonstrate notability; trivial coverage of a subject by secondary sources is not usually sufficient to establish notability." Sources   The article notes: "Xu, 35, inherited the company in 2015 after the unexpected death of his father, Dr. Rongxiang Xu, who founded MEBO. At the age of 27, the younger Xu was not ready to take over an international corporation, but he received much help and encouragement from mentors to help him get through the transition. ... The $1 million donation also gives Xu some benefits and responsibility, as he now co-chairs the APEC Host Committee ... Even though Kevin Xu lives in Los Angeles, he has strong ties with the Bay Area, too. Xu serves as the chair the board of directors at the Bay Area Council, a pro-business group in San Francisco. He’s also the board chair of Street Media LLC, which owns the Marina Times."   The article notes: "徐鹏出生的1988年是美宝集团成立的第二年，与美宝一起成长，... 2011年，从南加州大学神经科学专业毕业后，中西方科学和文化的融会贯通让他的视野和格局上升到新的境界和高度，他更加深刻地感知到人生价值和生命意义的神圣内涵. 毕业后，徐鹏进入美宝，开始与他的父亲徐荣祥一起研究和发展人体再生复原科学技术，为人类的健康和生命质量提升探索新的可能. " From Google Translate: "Kevin Xu was born in 1988, the second year after MEBO Group was established. He grew up with MEBO... In 2011, after graduating from the University of Southern California with a major in neuroscience, he studied Chinese and Western sciences and The integration of cultures brought his vision and structure to a new realm and height, and he more deeply felt the sacred connotation of the value and meaning of life. After graduation, Xu Peng entered MEBO and began to study and study with his father Xu Rongxiang. Develop human body regeneration and restoration science and technology to explore new possibilities for improving human health and quality of life."  <li> Although the article is overly promotional, Lux Mag's about page says, "Lux is a feminist magazine of politics and culture founded in 2021. We publish a glossy print edition three times a year featuring our award-winning writers, and a regular newsletter." It lists an advisory board, an editor-in-chief, editors, and contributing editors. The article notes: "He was born and raised in California, but we meet in London – he came for Royal Ascot, but also for meetings with charities and NGOs he’s interested in – before he headed to Japan for that country’s first-ever G20 summit. He’s on the advisory board of the California-China Trade Office, serves on the Asian Advisory Board at the University of Southern California’s Davis School of Gerontology, mentors young entrepreneurs at MIT, is the founder of the Kevin Xu Initiative at the Harris School of Public Policy at the University of Chicago and has endowed a new Neurotechnology Center in California Institute of Technology. The list goes on. Perhaps the relationships he is most proud of, however, are his ties to two former US presidents, Bill Clinton and Barack Obama. He’s a member of the Clinton Global Initiative and a contributor to the Obama Foundation, and recently spent a fortnight with Clinton in the US Virgin Islands, working with the 42nd president of the United States in connection with its efforts to help rebuild the region after the devastating 2017 hurricanes. ... And what of his co-ownership of Californian media outlet LA Weekly, which he acquired in 2017 alongside several other local investors?" </li> <li> The article notes: "生物醫藥公司MEBO的執行長、華裔徐鵬捐贈100萬作為APEC的舉辦經費，他也是參與APEC捐贈的最高贊助商之一、目前捐贈最多的華裔. " From Google Translate: "Kevin Xu, CEO of the biomedical company MEBO and a Chinese-American, donated 1 million to fund APEC. He is also one of the top sponsors of APEC donations and the Chinese-American who has donated the most." </li> </ol>There is sufficient coverage in reliable sources to allow Kevin Xu to pass Notability, which requires "significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject". Cunard (talk) 11:16, 24 November 2023 (UTC) </li></ul> Relisting comment: Relisting. Assessment of recently discovered sources would be helpful. Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 23:02, 24 November 2023 (UTC)
 * @Cunard I reject that Lux Magazine passes the WP:RS test. There is no statement of editorial integrity. They accept contributions from whomever, you just have to email them. Cielquiparle (talk) 13:33, 24 November 2023 (UTC)
 * Lux Mag's "The Team" page notes, "Darius Sanai is Editor in Chief of LUX and owner of parent company LUX Global Media. He is a consultant Editor in Chief at Condé Nast International. He launched Vogue Hong Kong in 2019 and has launched and edited more than 25 media brands for Condé Nast over the past 15 years." I see no indication on their website that "They accept contributions from whomever, you just have to email them". Would you provide a source for that? Even without the Lux Mag article, there is sufficient coverage in the other sources for Kevin Xu to pass Notability (people), which says, "multiple independent sources may be combined to demonstrate notability". Cunard (talk) 22:44, 24 November 2023 (UTC)
 * @Cunard Sorry but looking through the Lux magazine website really does not inspire confidence with regard to editorial independence. To answer your question, the quote from the "About" page says: "Lux welcomes pitches. Send a short email outlining your idea and why you’re the one to write it to pitches@lux-magazine.com." The publication also explicitly states that it "creates content for branding": "We create content, concepts and events for our partners and advise on strategic direction and brand...Our studio and our sister company Quartet Consulting offer a full suite of media and personal branding services, with a focus on UHNWI individuals and significant figures in the business, art and luxury space...We also offer services adding value to brands and individuals around the world and creating enduring and effective strategic partnerships through our contacts in art, luxury, wealth management and philanthropy." It's quite clear that a lot of the feature articles on "philanthropists" are vanity pieces. Pretty photographs and presentation, though. Cielquiparle (talk) 23:41, 24 November 2023 (UTC)
 * Thank you for the explanation. I am striking this source but maintaining my position supporting retention as the remaining sources are enough for Kevin Xu to pass Notability (people). Cunard (talk) 00:04, 25 November 2023 (UTC)
 * I agree, and a reliable source also mentioned that Xu Kaiwen was elected as the co-chair of this year's San Francisco APEC hosting committee.APEC 2023: Gwen Stefani, Canadian prime minister, Indonesian president among VIPs at Pres. Biden gala at Exploratorium - ABC7 San Francisco Exitdent (talk) 01:13, 25 November 2023 (UTC)
 * <p class="xfd_relist" style="margin:0 0 0 -1em;border-top: 1px solid #AAA; border-bottom: 1px solid #AAA; padding: 0px 2em;"> Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.


 * Weak delete This seems ok but trivial. The Lux discussed above seems a non-RS. I'm unsure about the rest. Oaktree b (talk) 21:04, 25 November 2023 (UTC)
 * The translated Chinese article in the second source seems ok, but I don't think these are enough for notability. Oaktree b (talk) 21:06, 25 November 2023 (UTC)
 * Hi . Here is another Chinese source that provides biographical information about the subject:<ol><li> The article notes: "眼前这个1988年出生的小伙，8岁就旅居国外，多元化的生活环境混合出他更独到的见解，他更善于找到中、西交融的切合点. 2015年4月，美宝集团创始人、美宝集团董事会前主席徐荣祥在美国意外逝世. ... 在父亲葬礼上，徐鹏收到两封手写的信，一封来自美国前总统克林顿，一封来自美国前总统奥巴马，... 一年后，徐鹏在山东济南出生. 8岁时，徐鹏被送往美国学习. ... 在2015年接手经营美宝集团之前，美国加利福尼亚州州长布朗就授予徐鹏顾问一职，助推加利福尼亚和中国之间的经贸往来. "  From DeepL and Google Translate: "The young man, born in 1988, has been living abroad since he was eight years old, and his diverse living environment has mixed with his unique insights, making him more adept at finding points of convergence between China and the West. ... Kevin Xu graduated from the University of Southern California, majoring in neuroscience. He is currently the Vice President of China Foreign Trade Council, Director of China Trade and Investment Commission, Chairman of Global Greater Bay Area Strategic Health Committee, and Chairman of the Board of Mebo Group. ...  At his father's funeral, Xu Peng received two handwritten letters, one from the former U.S. President Clinton, one from the former U.S. President Barack Obama ... A year later, Kevin Xu was born in Jinan, Shandong. At the age of 8, Kevin Xu was sent to the United States to study. ... Before Kevin Xu took over the management of MEBO Group in 2015, Governor Brown of California, USA, appointed Xu as a consultant to promote economic and trade exchanges between California and China." </li></ol>The combination of, , and  is enough for Kevin Xu to meet Notability (people), which says, "multiple independent sources may be combined to demonstrate notability". Cunard (talk) 23:34, 25 November 2023 (UTC)
 * Comment. I do not think the "translated article in the second source" referenced by Oaktree b (Li 2021) counts as independent coverage in a reliable source. Every interview-driven article needs to be considered on a case-by-case basis, and in this case there is nothing in the article that isn't something that Kevin Xu obviously said about himself, his father, his personal opinions, or recapping his CV, and it comes across as oddly self-promotional.


 * On that basis, though, the article that actually seems better than it did at first glance is the San Francisco Standard article (which is tempting to dismiss because of the Wikipedia article about the publication but taking a closer look, at least the publication itself currently has a strong statement of editorial standards). What I would highlight in the San Francisco Standard article are all the statements made which are things Kevin Xu obviously would not have offered about himself or which have a slightly different interpretation compared to what he told other interviewers:


 * "At the age of 27, the younger Xu was not ready to take over an international corporation, but he received much help and encouragement from mentors to help him get through the transition...In the Chinese-speaking world, MEBO faces many controversies involving Dr. Rongxiang Xu, with critics calling him a liar for claiming he developed the technology for so-called “human organ regeneration.” In response, MEBO’s official website posted an interview in which Rongxiang Xu denied the accusations and stood by his patent."


 * So for me, the strongest two articles contributing to the WP:BASIC standard of notability are the LA Times article about the lawsuit against Kevin Xu and other co-owner(s) of LA Weekly and the San Francisco Standard article pointing out the controversy about the MEBO "human organ regeneration" patent. Another article which puts some of the MEBO controversy into perspective, is "Snubbed for a Nobel?" in The Scientist, in which Kevin Xu explains why his father Dr. Rongxiang Xu decided to sue the Nobel Prize Committee for "excluding" him from the 2012 Nobel Prize for Medicine which was awarded for research in regenerative science:
 * "Xu’s son, Kevin, told The Scientist that those discoveries have since allowed 20 million burn victims to restore their normal skin, and according to the MEBO website, the treatments may have much broader applications, including regenerating organs and curing cancer...Xu’s son says his father did not submit his results to mainstream peer-reviewed journals because “he did not want to spend a lot of time writing articles for publication.” Xu did, however, publish in a journal he edits, called The Chinese Journal of Burns Wounds & Surface Ulcers, and with two other doctors, he wrote a book on MEBO techniques in 2004. For the past two decades, his findings were touted in online press releases and news stories in Chinese newspapers; a short 1992 documentary features his research; and at least one US company sees promise in Xu’s treatments. Botanical drug development company Skingenix, also based in Los Angeles, is sponsoring Phase II clinical trials to test whether MEBO products help heal foot ulcers and burns. These studies are not designed to shed light on whether MEBO and stem cells share anything in common, however, and Skingenix declined to comment on this story."
 * I am striking my previous !vote as I still really don't like the article (it has the appearance of "reputation laundering"), and a lot of the other independent coverage is more about the controversy about his father rather than about him, but if it is kept, I will try to help fix it.
 * On that note, I would ask Kevin Xu fans to please consider whether it is really worth keeping this article. He is obviously an individual who wants to keep tight control over his own narrative and always talks about himself (his father and CV and donations and emotions) rather than about his actual business decisions, results he has led his company to achieve, or directly addressing the controversies around MEBO and LA Weekly (except for The Scientist interview). If you read WP:AUTOBIOGRAPHY, you will see that it says about articles that have been requested by the person: Anything you submit will be edited mercilessly to make it neutral. Many autobiographical articles have become a source of dismay to their original authors after a period of editing by the community, and in several instances their original authors have asked that they be deleted – typically unsuccessfully, because if an article qualifies for deletion the community will typically do that without prompting, and an article won't be deleted just because its subject is unhappy with it. There are many other websites besides Wikipedia which would allow for more control for Kevin Xu to publish a more positive biography about himself and to continue to promote MEBO and Dr. Rongxiang Xu in a positive light. Cielquiparle (talk) 06:56, 26 November 2023 (UTC)
 * I am striking my previous !vote as I still really don't like the article (it has the appearance of "reputation laundering"), and a lot of the other independent coverage is more about the controversy about his father rather than about him, but if it is kept, I will try to help fix it. – thank you for reevaluating the sources and striking your previous vote. I've rewritten the article to remove promotional content and to make the focus more on him rather than on his father. I've tried to make the article as balanced as possible in touching upon the company's controversy with his father but not spending an overwhelming amount of ink on it. I hope the rewrite makes it easier for you to support the article's retention. Cunard (talk) 11:51, 27 November 2023 (UTC)
 * I also saw that Keivn Xu also established the Kevin Xu Initiative on Science, Abhilash Mishra is a member of the Initiative, and has published an article in Science magazine with the theme of "changing the status quo of American science".Abhilash Mishra,Director, Kevin Xu Initiative on Science, Technology and Global Development,Science's new frontier | Science Ransacked like 1776 (talk) 16:31, 27 November 2023 (UTC)


 * Comment. There are also new discoveries. He gets involved in many fields and is also a board member of UCI Esports.Esports Leadership Board — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ransacked like 1776 (talk • contribs) 22:02, 27 November 2023 (UTC)
 * <small class="delsort-notice">Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Biology-related deletion discussions. Cielquiparle (talk) 04:12, 28 November 2023 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. <b style="color:red">Please do not modify it.</b> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.