Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Kingdom of Rajarata


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   no consensus. Black Kite (talk) 09:15, 25 November 2012 (UTC)

Kingdom of Rajarata

 * – ( View AfD View log  Stats )

I believe this article is a hoax and as such request that it be deleted or redirected to Kingdom of Anuradhapura. I have nominated for AfD rather than WP:PROD because I suspect the article's creator will object to it being deleted.

Northern Sri Lanka has been known as Rajarata since ancient times but it wasn't ruled by a single kingdom from 5 century BCE to 13 century CE. It was instead ruled by a succession of kingdoms all of whom have separate articles: Tambapanni, Upatissa Nuwara, Anuradhapura, Chola and Polonnaruwa.

If the Kingdom of Rajarata had really existed it would be mentioned in Sri Lanka, History of Sri Lanka, Ancient history of Sri Lanka, Medieval history of Sri Lanka and List of Sri Lankan monarchs but it isn't.

There are a few articles that link to Kingdom of Rajarata but most of the these links were added by User:Himesh84, the creator of Kingdom of Rajarata - 1, 2, 3, 4, 5

I have looked at two well known books on Sri Lankan history - A History of Srilanka by K. M. De Silva and A Short History of Ceylon by H. W. Codrington - but neither mentions Kingdom of Rajarata. Google does provide some RS which mention Kingdom of Rajarata but often when they refer to Kingdom of Rajarata they actually mean Kingdom of Anuradhapura.  obi2canibe talk contr 13:18, 10 November 2012 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Sri Lanka-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 18:00, 10 November 2012 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of History-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 18:00, 10 November 2012 (UTC)


 * You should do more research about Sri Lanka. Before Kalinga Magha and Tamils come to Sri Lanka in Sri Lanka was internally divided into 3 parts. Rajarata, Malayarata and Rohana. These said kingdoms are not different kingdoms, but they are different administrative centers. To become different kingdoms areas of the influence needed to be change. But only the administrative center was changed during this period.same area, same blood line, same nation... Even the administrative center moved maximum 75Kms, the area ( Including later Jaffna Kingdom) under it wasn't changed. If you understand sinhala, Rajarata means (Raja + Rata - area under the King). There is no kingdoms like kingdom of London, Kingdom of Paris, Kingdom of Amsterdam,.. Actually Kingdom of Rajarata is wrong, because Rajarata already have the meaning (Sinhala) for Kingdom.--Himesh84 (talk) 17:50, 11 November 2012 (UTC)


 * Verifiability is one of the cornerstones of Wikipedia. The burden of evidence lies with the editor who adds the material. No evidence has been provided to show that there was a kingdom called Rajarata which lasted for 1,800 years. None of the paltry references given in the article mentions the Kingdom of Rajarata. I have already stated that De Silva and Codrington don't. Neither do Peebles, Holt, Kirk, Starn, Upham or Amazing Lanka. So, not only are the numerous editors who have worked on the various history articles wrong but so are respected historians De Silva, Codrington and Peebles. Is it really possible that so many people have overlooked a kingdom that lasted 18 centuries?-- obi2canibe talk contr 20:45, 13 November 2012 (UTC)


 * Please stop your games. You live in some Western country don't know anything about Sinhala but trying to comment as a expert on Sri Lanka. If you say Rajarata is not a kingdom what is it ? Is it a city in Sri Lanka ?
 * seach following term in google.
 * Elara from the Pandyan state invaded and ruled Rajarata from 205-161 BC - for 44 years
 * If you search about famous Sri Lankan kings eg: Parakramabahu I - most of them introduced as king of Rajarata. In your own definition for Rajarata in Rajarata is Land of the king. So you also accept Rajarata is land of the king but you want to play with the words and references.


 * Roman Empire is divided into Western Roman empire, Eastern Roman empire. Who cares about divisions. still all of them are used.
 * This is what I get from the Roman empire wiki page
 * 27 BC–476 AD (West);
 * 1453 (East)
 * Before judging how kingdom of Anuradhapura, pollannaruwa are parts of kingdom of Rajarata can you please tell me how Western Roman empire, Eastern Roman empire are parts of the Roman empire ?
 * I think since you live in western country you should correct it before raising concerns why Sri Lanka use several names. --Himesh84 (talk) 05:21, 14 November 2012 (UTC)


 * Obi2canibe, This is Rajarata page. What do you say about it ?
 * Rajarata (Raja = king, rata = country, or preferably land, thus the Land of Kings) is the name given to the region of Sri Lanka from which monarchs ruled the country from approximately the 5th Century BCE to the early 13th Century CE. It is centered around the ancient cities of Anuradhapura and Polonnaruwa in the North Central Province of Sri Lanka. Uttaradesa is the northern portion of Rajarata which includes the Jaffna peninsula.
 * http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Rajarata&diff=497921759&oldid=497920989
 * http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Rajarata&diff=521390189&oldid=520734383 --Himesh84 (talk) 09:46, 14 November 2012 (UTC)


 * I repeat, the burden of evidence lies with the editor who adds the material - you. You have not provided a single reference to prove that there was a kingdom called Rajarata which lasted 18 centuries. If I am so wrong and you are right, you should be able to provide RS. This discussion is about Kingdom of Rajarata, not Rajarata - they are two distinct things.-- obi2canibe talk contr 20:59, 14 November 2012 (UTC)


 * Monarchs ruled the country from 5BC-13CE. It is centered around cities Anuradhapura, Polonnaruwa,.. If you are not talking about a kingdom what is it ?
 * It is useless to argue with you because what you raise is a useless and very much minor thing. Can you double check how many wiki-pages which haven't annexed English word "Kingdom" in any source but mentioned as kingdoms ? You are searching English words in a Sinhalese culture. Search Short History of Ceylon for the meaning of Rajarata. It clearly says Country of the King. Country is similar name used for the kingdom at those days. Since you want to play with words and references, for your request I can give you this article ( http://www.dailynews.lk/2012/07/16/fea03.asp ), but it is not fit into the current content of the wiki page.
 * I am adding following sentences since I am feared that you will not be able to find
 * Padaviya: the Eastern Capital of the Rajarata Kingdom
 * But gradually the region had developed as the centre of the Eastern Division (Pacinadésa) of the Rajarata kingdom.
 * Note. Meaning of the "Rajarata kingdom" is 100% equal to the "kingdom of rajarata". Please don't ask for reference but it is the word order of Sinhalese culture. If you ask, I will report you to administrators.
 * Can you please correct the duration of the Roman empire too. It was ended in 300, But in this article says Roman empire lasted until 1500. Western Roman Empire ruled the west half, independent Byzantine ruled the Eastern part. So what was ruled by Roman empire in this era and who are the kings ? Don't you smell something is wrong ? --Himesh84 (talk) 05:36, 15 November 2012 (UTC)
 * Note. Meaning of the "Rajarata kingdom" is 100% equal to the "kingdom of rajarata". Please don't ask for reference but it is the word order of Sinhalese culture. If you ask, I will report you to administrators.
 * Can you please correct the duration of the Roman empire too. It was ended in 300, But in this article says Roman empire lasted until 1500. Western Roman Empire ruled the west half, independent Byzantine ruled the Eastern part. So what was ruled by Roman empire in this era and who are the kings ? Don't you smell something is wrong ? --Himesh84 (talk) 05:36, 15 November 2012 (UTC)


 * There's no point in continuing this duologue if you consider Verifiability to be a minor thing. I'll leave it up to other editors to comment.-- obi2canibe talk contr 20:28, 15 November 2012 (UTC)
 * Does anything needs to continue. You said you can't find any reference. I have given one. Now I am going to edit the page since I have provided required info and you have leaved the discussion without accepting you got a what you asked (a reference) --Himesh84 (talk) 05:08, 16 November 2012 (UTC)

Delete: My time here on Wikipedia has been mostly spent on creating and developing articles relating to ancient Sri Lankan history. In fact I have created and spent many hours on the articles that have been linked above in the first few paragraphs. And in my time researching I have never come across the Kingdom of Rajarata. As Himesh84 has described Rajarata himself, it is a term meaning "King's country" and was an internal division or subdivision of the various successive kingdoms up until the 13th century. To put it more simply Rajarata was the traditional area in which the Sri Lankan King governed. An area that can probably be compared to a modern day province but not an independent kingdom. However calling it an administrating center is much more acceptable.

The article itself is poorly structured and poorly referenced, and seems to be a mash up from other articles. The article Rajarata (which is now a redirect to this page) correctly informed us of what Rajarata was. Therefore this article should be deleted or any reference to Rajarata being a kingdom should be removed and the article properly written and referenced.--Blackknight12 (talk) 02:30, 16 November 2012 (UTC)


 * I doubt you work on Sri Lanka having some pre-knowledge. At least please read the comment before you. http://www.dailynews.lk/2012/07/16/fea03.asp --Himesh84 (talk) 05:08, 16 November 2012 (UTC)
 * Sri Lanka has a written history of over 2500 years and your only proof of a Kingdom of Rajarata is that article you have linked. Furthermore in that article there is only one instance referring to a Kingdom of Rajarata. Obi2canibe has already asked for proper evidence and verification (not newspaper articles) yet you still have not provided.--Blackknight12 (talk) 06:56, 16 November 2012 (UTC)
 * You said you never come across Kingdom of Rajarata. Now you asking one is not enough for you. But you must check Verifiability. No mentioned about number of examples. It is enough to have a document, article, paper, or book. So I have given a article by PROF. W. I. SIRIWEERA. Publisher is well recognized news publisher in Sri Lanka. They sell lot of news papers within Sri Lanka since 1918. Can you be on standards and tell under which wikipedia policy does it say one article is not enough ?
 * 2500 years history written in Sri Lanka. That is correct. But Mahavamsa has many reference about Rajarata, Anuradhapura, Pollonnaruwa, ... Does the written history distinct what is the kingdom and what is the capital ? These kingdom kind of definitions are later derivatives. Some called it by Area (Kingdom of England,France,Italy,...). Some called it by capital(Rome. anything else please ?). You can't say only one is correct. Rome empire, Kingdom of Italy, Kingdom of papacy,.. for one area. Likewise in Sri Lanka so written 2500 history Mahawamsa state ancient kings ruled from Rajarata some other source says they ruled from different capitals of the Rajarata area. If you read those ancient history of Mahavamsa,chulavamsa,.. most of them talking Rajarata as the kingdom. I don't know which books you read and why you unable to find Rajarata is a kingdom
 * You can find lot of books in here which talking about Rajarata as a kingdom.
 * https://www.google.com/search?q=mahawamsa+rajarata+king&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a#q=rajarata+%2B+kingdom&hl=en&client=firefox-a&tbo=d&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&tbm=bks&source=lnms&sa=X&ei=WgKmUNnBEOaLjAKAs4HQBQ&ved=0CAkQ_AUoAA&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_cp.r_qf.&fp=f316b7445f503d95&bpcl=38625945&biw=1356&bih=583
 * articles
 * http://www.island.lk/2003/02/22/satmag04.html
 * http://www.dailynews.lk/2004/10/13/artscop12.html
 * --Himesh84 (talk) 09:17, 16 November 2012 (UTC)
 * http://www.island.lk/2003/02/22/satmag04.html
 * http://www.dailynews.lk/2004/10/13/artscop12.html
 * --Himesh84 (talk) 09:17, 16 November 2012 (UTC)


 * http://www.island.lk/2002/01/27/featur01.html
 * http://www.island.lk/2010/05/11/news29.html
 * Obi2canibe and Blackknight12, If you are not sure about something or don't know something happened in far distance country in which English is not the regular language please don't mark it as AFD. First you can use search engines like Google or Yahoo. You can enter search term (keywords) and search for books,articles,... If you are unable to search there is a feature called "Citation Need". In which you can ask author to provide required sources. --Himesh84 (talk) 12:34, 17 November 2012 (UTC)


 * Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.


 * Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, -- Cheers, Riley   Huntley  00:14, 18 November 2012 (UTC)


 * Comment - None of the references provided by Himesh84 mentions a kingdom called Rajarata which lasted 18 centuries. When they refer to Kingdom Rajarata they are actually referring to Kingdom of Anuradhapura or Kingdom of Polonnaruwa as I mentioned in my first comment.-- obi2canibe talk contr 13:40, 18 November 2012 (UTC)
 * This your first comment. "Google does provide some RS which mention Kingdom of Rajarata but often when they refer to Kingdom of Rajarata they actually mean Kingdom of Anuradhapura". Now you have added Polonnaruwa. Also has used incorrect word "or".
 * It is not "or". It is "and". http://www.dailynews.lk/2004/10/13/artscop12.html. Editor called me and asked don't directly pick sentences due to copywriter issues. So when we says it in our words Kingdom of Rajarata had been lasted at least from Anuradhapura to Pollonnaruwa. That means 347Bc to 1215 BC. 1562 years. I am not able to get a relation between Tambapanni and kingdom of Rajarata since when I type it in the Google thousands of hits coming on about Anuradhapura " It was 3rd capital of the Kingdom of Rajarata after Tambapanni and Upatissa Nuwara". Can't find the bottom. If it hadn't lasted 18 centuries please correct it without deleting the wikipage.--Himesh84 (talk) 06:52, 19 November 2012 (UTC)


 * Keep but heavily prune -- A Google Scholar search indicates that the term is used in academic literature. I would however suggest that the article should be redueced to little more than a dab-page, since it would appear that historians have normally referred to the kingdom by its successive capitals.  If the term is used, we ought to have an article so that people who come across it can look up what it is.  I have to confess that I am no expert on this subject, but this is suggested as  apossible solution to the conflict apparent from this AFD discussion.  The citations indicate that this is NOT a HOAX, but their very limited number suggests to me that this is not the name preferred by hisotirans for the polity.  Peterkingiron (talk) 18:41, 20 November 2012 (UTC)


 * Keep - There are many academic references to the "Kingdom of Rajarata" as a general Kingdom/civilization that excited in the area known as Rajarata for several centuries. The capitals of this kingdom changed however the population or the ruling class, with the exception of invaders didn't change. Therefore this article should be kept and expanded. Cossde (talk) 06:00, 25 November 2012 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.