Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Krystian Żołnierewicz


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was no consensus. Personally I think there is enough here for GNG, but I'm not sure there is the consensus for a keep here. Certainly though there isn't enough for delete. Fenix down (talk) 07:55, 22 September 2019 (UTC)

Krystian Żołnierewicz

 * – ( View AfD View log  Stats )

Article about former footballer who made 4 appearances (2 as a starter, 2 as a substitute) in Poland's fully-pro Ekstraklasa. Although this appears to satisfy the bright-line of WP:NFOOTBALL, it does not because there is longstanding consensus that a footballer who played a minimal amount in a fully-pro league but comprehensively fails WP:GNG does not actually satisfy NFOOTBALL (see e.g., Articles for deletion/Phakamani Mngadi). All of the online coverage in Polish- and English-language sources appear to be routine (database entries, transfer announcements, and a few brief notes on his league debut and an unsuccessful trial with AS Roma after his debut season); I tried to rescue this article from the unsourced BLP pile, but the subject simply isn't notable. Jogurney (talk) 21:43, 29 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Sportspeople-related deletion discussions. Shellwood (talk) 21:45, 29 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Football-related deletion discussions. Shellwood (talk) 21:45, 29 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Poland-related deletion discussions. Shellwood (talk) 21:45, 29 August 2019 (UTC)


 * Keep I think it's sourceable, and  are beyond routine in my opinion, along with links like  which may not technically count towards WP:GNG but shows there's enough out there on him to write a fully sourced article. SportingFlyer  T · C  00:02, 30 August 2019 (UTC)
 * SF's second link, from Weszlo (Gtranslate) looks like WP:SIGCOV to me; not sure about the other two. – Levivich 01:13, 30 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Weak delete. All three sources linked above are WP:INTERVIEW, through the first two are at least rewritten partially for the tone. Another issue is reliability of sources. The third one is a regional newspaper, but the first two, some internet portals that don't seem to have even a page on rather inclusive Polish Wikipedia (Alexa rank: sport.pl is #66 in Poland, weszlo.com is #644 in Poland). So sport.pl coverage seems pretty decent, popularity wise, but the entry is also very short, almost like a press release based on an interview, little better than pure stats - I mean, it's just pure stats in sentence mode. As such, I think he fails WP:NBIO. Given NSPORTS super inclusitivity, it would be borderline, but we really need to tighten our guidelines here, and I feel that three interviews in minor/niche outlets are not sufficient. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 06:41, 30 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in WikiProject Football's list of association football-related deletions. GiantSnowman 08:19, 30 August 2019 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Keep - meets NFOOTBALL and enough out there to likely meet GNG. GiantSnowman 08:46, 30 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Delete – sources indicate he stopped playing years ago, in 2013 or 2015. Not finding two GNG sources. 4 appearances in the 2010s does not suggest off-line sources are out there. – Levivich 01:04, 31 August 2019 (UTC)
 * Keep meets WP:NFOOTBALL with four appearances in a top-flight fully professional league. Number   5  7  16:05, 1 September 2019 (UTC)
 * Keep meets WP:NFOOTBALL.Pharaoh of the Wizards (talk) 01:26, 2 September 2019 (UTC)
 * Delete. Did not appear in any international game, fails WP:GNG Alex-h (talk) 08:28, 2 September 2019 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, RL0919 (talk) 22:16, 5 September 2019 (UTC)  Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Delete. Subject barely scrapes WP:NFOOTY & WP:NBIO and then disappears from view. To quote from this AfD's decision: There is clear consensus that players who scrape over the line of the SNG and can be shown to have essentially ended their careers are not presumed to pass GNG unless clear sources can be presented. See WP:INDISCRIMINATE. -The Gnome (talk) 21:10, 11 September 2019 (UTC)
 * Great point. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 06:00, 13 September 2019 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, – filelakeshoe (t / c) 🐱 11:24, 13 September 2019 (UTC)
 * Comment – Same comment I've brought up elsewhere. Interviews are (arguably) primary sources (along with statistics websites, game reports, transfer reports, etc.) Are there any non-interview secondary sources upon which we can base this article? Without a real secondary source, I don't see how this article can be kept and yet comply with core policy WP:NOR: Wikipedia articles should be based on reliable, published secondary sources and, to a lesser extent, on tertiary sources and primary sources. Here, we seem to be basing an article entirely on primary sources–and if it's just interviews, entirely on ABOUTSELF sources. – Levivich 15:15, 13 September 2019 (UTC)
 * Keep - Somehow missed this AfD until now, blind as a bat! Understandable nom., given the low apps/prior examples, but there's enough out there for GNG:, , , even ; as well as, though I somewhat understand the questioning: , and . I disagree with those denouncing interviews. If they were quick three-question pure Q+As after matches, sure, but they're about his career to-date at that time with good depth input along with the interview, esp. #4 & #6. As for those questioning the strength/integrity of guidelines, an AfD isn't the place to examine them - as, most recently, noted at AfD/Atantaake Tooma. AfD/Phakamani Mngadi is a disingenuous comparison, given they had very little to no articles written about them. R96Skinner (talk) 16:52, 13 September 2019 (UTC)
 * Delete. The "passes NFOOTY" handwaves are irrelevant in light of the compelling dissection of the sources by Piotrus and Levivich. --Mkativerata (talk) 22:17, 13 September 2019 (UTC)
 * Except there's WP:GNG arguments made by both myself and R96Skinner. There's more out there than just the couple of sources I added. SportingFlyer  T · C  23:15, 13 September 2019 (UTC)


 * Keep looking at the sources that R96Skinner lists above, easily meets GNG, and that's without using the interviews. I'm also baffled by these claims that in-depth comprehensive interviews don't count as GNG - I don't see any policy behind that. Or the claims that he's no longer playing - how is that relevant? Nfitz (talk) 22:23, 21 September 2019 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.