Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Lacey Beaty


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep‎__EXPECTED_UNCONNECTED_PAGE__. I think editors coming in after the final relisting have provided sources that overcome Deletion objections. Just a note that while it's discouraged to relist AFD discussions more than twice, sometimes the discussion can change significantly after a third relisting. Liz Read! Talk! 05:17, 14 July 2023 (UTC)

Lacey Beaty

 * – ( View AfD View log | edits since nomination)

First female mayor should be notable, but coverage is all routine happenings. Beaverton is a mid-size town, not notable on a national scale. The bit about the former mayor being arrested for being a pedophile isn't particularly helpful. Would be a stronger keep if she was featured in a large newspaper or the like, rather than just reporting on what she's done for the city. Oaktree b (talk) 02:35, 16 June 2023 (UTC) Keep: I agree that there were significant flaws in the way in which the article was originally presented. I appreciate Oaktree b's recommendations about the reference to the former mayor and the extensive information about what she has done for the city. I have made edits accordingly. However, I disagree that Beaty does not meet the notability threshold. While the average mayor of Beaverton, Oregon may not be particularly noteworthy, Beaty is the first woman and youngest mayor in the city's history, as Oaktree b mentioned. Additionally, she has participated in national events, and contributed to national organizations, that I did not include in the article, but they have broadened her notability nonetheless. Even if Beaty wasn't the first female or youngest mayor of the city, it wouldn't be unprecedented for her to have a page; several other current mayors of midsized cities in Oregon have Wikipedia articles (see: Lucy Vinis, Chris Hoy, and Steve Callaway). I appreciate the opportunity to make this article better, but I strongly discourage deletion. Biznaga22 (talk) 8:37, 16 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Politicians-related deletion discussions. Oaktree b (talk) 02:35, 16 June 2023 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Enos733 (talk) 03:23, 23 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Women and Oregon. Hey man im josh (talk) 12:40, 16 June 2023 (UTC)
 *  Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.


 * Keep. Here's what Notability (people) says at the very top of the page ("Basic criteria"):
 * "People are presumed notable if they have received significant coverage in multiple published secondary sources that are reliable, intellectually independent of each other, and independent of the subject."
 * "If the depth of coverage in any given source is not substantial, then multiple independent sources may be combined to demonstrate notability; trivial coverage of a subject by secondary sources is not usually sufficient to establish notability."
 * WP:NPOL is the subsection of Wikipedia:Notability (people) that mentions politicians. Referring to local politicians it says:
 * "Just being an elected local official, or an unelected candidate for political office, does not guarantee notability, although such people can still be notable if they meet the general notability guideline."
 * There's full-length reliable, independent news coverage of this mayor.
 * -- A. B. (talk • contribs • global count) 04:24, 23 June 2023 (UTC)

Relisting comment: Relisting although I see a slight edge to those advocating Keeping this article. But it seems to rest on differing interpretations of Notability and Routine and how they apply to this article. Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz Read! Talk! 05:03, 30 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Delete: The job of local news is to cover local politicians; it is literally their journalistic duty to report on who was elected mayor of their town. Thus, hyper-local news articles like constitutes what I would consider to be superficial and typical coverage, routine in thousands upon thousands of communities. Without wide coverage, there has to be something that sets her mayoral tenure apart, whether that be a notable policy that generated coverage or a significant position or something like that. The subject has simply not been written about in-depth enough to justify an argument for WP:NPOL#2 and the hyper-local coverage that does exist isn't satisfactory for WP:GNG. Curbon7 (talk) 04:59, 23 June 2023 (UTC)
 * KATU, which you cite as "hyper-local", is the ABC News affiliate for the Portland, Oregon metropolitan area (population: 2.5 million people - about the size of the Orlando area). The oregonlive.com website is Portland's Oregonian, the second largest newspaper in the Pacific Northwest; it's won 8 Pullitzer Prizes.
 * The closing admin will follow the guidance I quoted above in my "keep" comment. They'll look at the articles I cited and decide for themselves.
 * -- A. B. (talk • contribs • global count) 05:33, 23 June 2023 (UTC)
 * According to its article, KATU-TV is owned by the Sinclair Broadcast Group, which should be taken into consideration when assessing the source. Beccaynr (talk) 05:55, 23 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Even The Washington Post and The New York Times, two of the country's premier newspapers, provide coverage of local affairs that have little demonstrative notability, so the argument about how many Pulitzer Prizes an outlet has is pretty irrelevant here. Regardless, The Oregonian source that you provided is mostly coverage of someone else, with the subject receiving barely a passing mention. Curbon7 (talk) 07:32, 23 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Keep per Biznaga22 and A. B., subject only to some personal wariness of the long-term maintainability of articles at this level. But I did a ctrl-F on Notability and Notability (people) to make sure that nothing had changed since my last checkin, and have confirmed neither of these guidelines excludes local coverage. Nor should they: such an exclusion would have the effect of backdooring notability into a test of the significance of the article subject, which is not and never has been the standard. Full-length profiles are not, in general, examples of WP:ROUTINE coverage.The fundamental question in notability is: is there an adequate quantity of suitable source material for an article? I think the sources cited in the above discussion make it clear that there is. As to the reliability of local sources, I think they meet the crucial threshold of being sources of the kind that experts in the field would rely on. I am no expert on Oregon municipal politics, but I cannot imagine that any expert in that field would prefer the NYT (for example) to a local source. As a character in my favorite forgotten 1990s drama stated, the paper of record somehow invariably manages to get some important detail wrong. And while Sinclair affiliation is something to keep an eye on, in my own limited experience elsewhere Sinclair stations tend to play local politics pretty straight. In sum, as there is adequate material to build an article from, and nothing here appears to bump up against the guardrails of WP:NOT or WP:BLP, there is no basis for deletion. -- Visviva (talk) 22:59, 24 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Delete and easily and strongly so - mayors are not inherently notable and she has not received any non-local press. The "national" references aren't really national references, they're just conferences or development programmes she attended. The fact other mayors have articles isn't proof of anything and there's at least one of those articles which also doesn't pass notability standards. And it's absolutely WP:ROUTINE for a mayor to have a feature article printed in a local newspaper - that's the point of local newspapers! There's nothing here showing she's a notable politician at all outside the city she's in charge of. (If there's a list of mayors of Beaverton, that would be a valid redirect target.)
 * SportingFlyer  T · C  09:54, 26 June 2023 (UTC)
 * What is routine coverage? WP:SBST, a subsection of our main notability guideline, says this:
 * "For example, routine news coverage such as press releases, public announcements, sports coverage, and tabloid journalism is not significant coverage."
 * WP:SIGCOV (a.k.a. WP:GNG, gives the rationale, which I believe clinches the argument for this article:
 * "Significant coverage" addresses the topic directly and in detail, so that no original research is needed to extract the content. Significant coverage is more than a trivial mention, but it does not need to be the main topic of the source material.
 * This definitely applies to this mayor -- there is substantial independent coverage of her in multiple reliable sources to support this article.
 * WP:ROUTINE is a subsection of Notability (events). Mayor Beatty is not an event.
 * Notability (people) is instead the applicable guideline. Here's what the guideline says at the very top ("Basic criteria"):
 * "People are presumed notable if they have received significant coverage in multiple published secondary sources that are reliable, intellectually independent of each other, and independent of the subject."
 * "If the depth of coverage in any given source is not substantial, then multiple independent sources may be combined to demonstrate notability; trivial coverage of a subject by secondary sources is not usually sufficient to establish notability."
 * WP:NPOL is the subsection of Wikipedia:Notability (people) that mentions politicians. Referring to local politicians it says:
 * "Just being an elected local official, or an unelected candidate for political office, does not guarantee notability, although such people can still be notable if they meet the general notability guideline."
 * The article cites full-length reliable, independent news coverage of this mayor.
 * These are our guidelines and they're what the closing admin will use to decide this case.
 * -- A. B. (talk • contribs • global count) 22:20, 26 June 2023 (UTC)
 * None of this is correct - local politicians frequently only receive coverage in local papers, and that coverage itself is WP:ROUTINE. If that were true, then every mayor in every town would always be notable, considering mayoral elections always generate coverage - but that's not the case, and we use a combination of common sense and the scope of the media coverage to determine whether someone should have a stand-alone article written about them. SportingFlyer  T · C  20:23, 9 July 2023 (UTC)
 *  Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.

Relisting comment: Final relist Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz Read! Talk! 05:02, 7 July 2023 (UTC)
 * Delete. Wikipedia now has more than its share of "the first X to be Y" type of articles, so piling-on makes it seem more like intereating trivia rather than notable fact. The office is not inherently notable, so there isn't really much justification. 128.252.154.9 (talk) 21:02, 6 July 2023 (UTC)
 * "The office is not inherently notable, so there isn't really much justification" does not make sense. you have not provided a valid reason for deletion per policy. Do not post nonsense.
 * This IP voter is very suspect Naomijeans (talk) 02:33, 14 July 2023 (UTC)
 * I just looked at the IP's 5 contributions - they all seem legit. IP is registered to Washington University. I disagree with their !vote and their reasoning but comment doesn't seem to have been made in bad faith. -- A. B. (talk • contribs • global count) 03:41, 14 July 2023 (UTC)
 *  Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.


 * Delete "first X to be Y" doesn't automatically constitute notability. Coverage is WP:ROUTINE as well, the office itself also lacks notability. --TheInsatiableOne (talk) 10:47, 7 July 2023 (UTC)
 * It is not sufficient that Beaty is the first female and youngest mayor of Beaverton, so this is not a case of "the first X to be Y." The article should be kept because Beaty meets the "general notability guideline." As A. B. pointed out, the WP:ROUTINE guideline is meant for events. Since this is a biography of a living person, we should be looking at the "general notability guideline" under WP:NOTABILITY, which is required under the politicians and judges section of WP:NOTABILITY (people). This policy states that, "A topic is presumed to be suitable for a stand-alone article or list when it has received significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject." WP:SIGCOV is met since there is enough source material to write an accurate biography without "original research." Additionally, I don't see any arguments for deletion that accurately refute the reliability or the independence of the sources in the article. Biznaga22 (talk) 23:02, 7 July 2023 (UTC)
 * If WP:ROUTINE were used only for events, every mayor in every town would be notable, but we use WP:ROUTINE in every article - not just events - for its clear guidance on interpreting coverage: Per Wikipedia policy, routine news coverage of such things as announcements are not sufficient basis for an article. And mayoral elections are the very basis of routine - every village, town, and city in the United States has them at specified intervals, and they always receive routine coverage. The coverage for this particular article does not rise above routine coverage - if she had received coverage outside her metropolitan area, for instance, then I'd be on the keep side, but that's not the case here. SportingFlyer  T · C  20:26, 9 July 2023 (UTC)
 * "If WP:ROUTINE were used only for events, every mayor in every town would be notable, but we use WP:ROUTINE in every article - not just events…"
 * WP:ROUTINE is a shortcut to Notability (events)
 * If, however, you apply WP:ROUTINE anyway, here are the examples it gives as "routine":
 * "Wedding announcements, sports scores, crime logs, and other items that tend to get an exemption from newsworthiness discussions should be considered routine. Routine events such as sports matches, film premieres, press conferences etc. may be better covered as part of another article, if at all."
 * None of those examples apply to the coverage we're citing, all of which met newsworthiness requirements when published.
 * -- A. B. (talk • contribs • global count) 21:07, 9 July 2023 (UTC)

Keep per the significant coverage in multiple independent reliable sources. The subject passes Notability (people), which says: "People are presumed if they have received significant coverage in  that are,  of each other, and .If the depth of coverage in any given source is not substantial, then multiple independent sources may be combined to demonstrate notability; trivial coverage of a subject by secondary sources is not usually sufficient to establish notability." Analysis of the sources   Lacey Beaty received significant coverage in The Oregonian, which is the largest newspaper in Oregon and the second largest newspaper in the Pacific Northwest. She received additional coverage in other Oregon sources like the Beaverton Valley Times, KATU, KGW, Oregon Public Broadcasting, the Portland Business Journal, and the Portland Tribune. This is sufficient to meet Notability (people), which says, "Just being an elected local official, or an unelected candidate for political office, does not guarantee notability, although such people can still be notable if they meet the general notability guideline." WP:ROUTINE, which redirects to Notability (events), does not apply to Lacey Beaty because she is a person, not an event. Sources  <li> The article notes: "Lacey Beaty is a U.S. Army veteran who has also served overseas, three years in Germany and one in Iraq. She previously told the Beaverton Leader that she struggled to reintegrate into civilian life, and Beaverton gave her the stability and support she needed. That’s part of what motivated her to run for council." </li> <li> The article notes: "Beaverton lacrosse coach and U.S. Army veteran Lacey Beaty has filed to run against Beaverton City Councilor Ian King in this year’s election. ... Beaty, 29, has lived in Beaverton since 2008 with her husband, Ian Beaty. She moved to Oregon after serving in the U.S. Army, including three years in Germany and one in Iraq. ... Beaty is currently vice chair of the Beaverton Visioning Advisory Committee. She coaches lacrosse at Beaverton High School, is vice chair on the HomePlate Youth Services Board of Directors and serves on the Leadership Beaverton Board of Directors." </li> <li> The article notes: "Council position 1: Lacey Beaty • 29 • Lacrosse coach Past public service • Vice chairwoman of the Beaverton Visioning Advisory Committee • Vice chairwoman on HomePlate Youth Services Board of Directors • Leadership Beaverton Board of Directors Other • Served in the U.S. Army, including three years in Germany and one in Iraq" </li> <li> The article notes: "Beaverton City Council has a new face this week after community activist and U.S. Army veteran Lacey Beaty was set to be sworn in Tuesday. Beaty, who has lived in Beaverton since 2008, served as vice chair on the city’s Visioning Advisory Committee, was vice chair on HomePlate Youth Services board of directors, and was on the Leadership Beaverton board of directors. She had no intention to run for City Council." </li> <li> The article notes: "Beaverton City Councilor Lacey Beaty defeated incumbent Denny Doyle in the election. He’d been mayor of the city since 2009. ... Beaty has been a member of the Beaverton City Council since 2015." </li> <li> The article notes: "Homelessness, the Downtown Loop and community safety were key highlights as Mayor Lacey Beaty reflected on the last year and looked toward the future during the annual State of the City address Monday evening, March 12. At the Patricia Reser Center for the Arts, Beaty shared with the packed in-person crowd the city's successes in 2022 and gave residents a glimpse of what to expect in 2023. Beaty brought up the challenge of addressing homelessness just one minute into her remarks during the State of the City, after thanking notable members of the audience for attending the event." </li> <li>Articles from Gabby Urenda in Beaverton Valley Times:<ol> <li> The article notes: "Beaverton residents have spoken, and Lacey Beaty will be the city's new mayor. The mayor-elect defeated incumbent Denny Doyle in last week's general election on Tuesday, Nov. 3, by a margin of about 7 percentage points. Doyle conceded the race the following day" </li> <li> The article notes: "Beaty will be the first woman to serve as mayor of Beaverton. ... Beaty also wants to have public safety at the forefront — more specifically, making sure the right people are doing the right work when it comes to community safety policing, she added. ... She will officially be sworn in as mayor at the Beaverton City Council's first regular meeting in January." </li> </ol></li> <li> The article notes: "Why we chose Lacey: She’s transforming Beaverton city government, literally, as the city is transitioning from a commission form of government to a city manager form of government. The changes come as Beaverton, economically, becomes more of an extension of, as opposed to a complement to, Portland. She’s also an Army veteran, who served as a medic in Iraq." </li> <li> The article notes: "Longtime incumbent Denny Doyle was defeated by progressive challenger Lacey Beaty. ... Beaty is fine with the progressive label but she also stresses that she's her own person and Beaverton has its own identity separate from Portland. ... Beaty begins her term as Beaverton mayor on Jan. 1." </li> <li> The article notes: "For Mayor Beaty, that busy month ended in a weekend skiing accident on Timberline. She tore her meniscus and was scheduled for surgery Friday. ... Beaty said she's spent a lot of her first weeks in office explaining to businesses and other officials the city interacts with how their new system of government works. Beaverton voters approved a city charter change to a mayor-city manager form of government with a full-time mayor. She's also spending a lot of time listening to people." </li> <li> The article notes: "Beaty was appointed to the Human Development steering committee ... Beaty's work will include development of federal policy positions for the National League of Cities on social services, children and learning, poverty, employment and workforce development, social security and seniors," </li> </ol>There is sufficient coverage in reliable sources to allow Lacey Beaty to pass Notability, which requires "significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject". Cunard (talk) 01:20, 10 July 2023 (UTC) </li></ul>
 * Keep per Cunard, source coverage looks to support on notability and quality. - Indefensible (talk) 07:12, 11 July 2023 (UTC)
 * Keep per WP:HEY, WP:GNG and WP:SUSTAINED. Article has improved and expanded significantly over the course of this discussion (and has changed a lot in the last 24 hours), so please do have another read: Lacey Beaty. I actually agree with the argument that "local" city coverage (i.e., Beaverton Valley Times) is not enough to justify notability for a mayor, but in this case, in addition to in-depth local coverage about her Outstanding Veteran of the Year Award from the Oregon Department of Veterans Affairs), we have WP:SIGCOV at the regional level (Portland Business Journal's "40 Under 40" 2022); at the state level (several articles in The Oregonian as highlighted above by Cunard, as well as this article by the Oregon Capital Insider which was widely syndicated to other Oregon city publications such as the Corvallis Gazette-Times); and at the national level in Politico, which named Lacey Beaty to its inaugural Fifty Mayors Club (and published her biography which we can be confident they fact-checked). Many other sources have been added to the article, which is now quite comprehensive (while trying to avoid going overboard with local detail), and was rated "B"-level by Rater. Cielquiparle (talk) 03:43, 12 July 2023 (UTC)
 * Keep - Per User A.B. who has summarized policies and provided links to 5 articles that establish notability. Naomijeans (talk) 02:30, 14 July 2023 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. <b style="color:red">Please do not modify it.</b> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.