Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Latitude 42 Brewing Company


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was no consensus. Black Kite (talk) 08:20, 7 November 2016 (UTC)

Latitude 42 Brewing Company

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Appears to be nothing more than WP:PROMO with no real indication of notability. John from Idegon (talk) 21:19, 9 October 2016 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Companies-related deletion discussions. North America1000 21:55, 9 October 2016 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Food and drink-related deletion discussions. North America1000 21:55, 9 October 2016 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Michigan-related deletion discussions. North America1000 21:55, 9 October 2016 (UTC)


 * Comment - This page was not intended to be a promotion for the brewery.  This is a college project.  I researched many other notable Michigan breweries, which all had a wiki page, and decided to make a page for this particular brewery.  I added some additional references on the page to demonstrate the breweries international notability and removed a line which may have been perceived as biased.  Ricky beausoleil (talk) 02:30, 10 October 2016 (UTC)
 * Delete as the listed information and sources are PR alone, showing what only the company would include as part of its PR advertising and that's what this is exactly, everything listed is trivial and this is making it nearly speedy material; for example the fact it's a first for the local community of Portage, therefore it's not actually significant. SwisterTwister   talk  06:08, 10 October 2016 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Keep – The brewery satisfies WP:GNG and WP:Breweries. Here's what I'm going by, but only the first four are already included in the article, the rest need to be added:        — Mudwater (Talk) 23:13, 10 October 2016 (UTC)
 * I've added the other three references. — Mudwater (Talk) 06:24, 11 October 2016 (UTC)
 * Pinging some more editors who might have an opinion on this question: Feel free to chime in.  — Mudwater (Talk) 11:03, 12 October 2016 (UTC)
 * Keep per WP:GNG. All information in the article comes from reliable sources. The nomination appears to have been made in the mistaken belief that articles about commercial establishments can only be promotional, but that is not true — it is ok for us to describe such subjects in factual terms and that's all our article does. —David Eppstein (talk) 16:28, 12 October 2016 (UTC)
 * Redirect to List of breweries in Michigan for now. I am not impressed by the references or the awards. My personal criteria for brewing companies: They qualify to be included in a "list of breweries in..." if they have an independent reference, which this does, so it can go in the list. But these references are routine (directories, local paper stories, etc.), of the type that go to every brewery that ever opens anywhere, so they don't make it notable. As for the awards: there are so many brewing competitions, all handing out hundreds of medals, that I don't count state or local competition awards (even if they are called "international," as most of them are) as significant. I really only regard medals from the two most respected competitions - namely, the Great American Beer Festival and the World Beer Cup - as being significant enough to guarantee an article. Maybe later, this brewery has only been open for 3 years. I should add, I do NOT find the article to be promotional; in fact it is well written and sourced. My objection is based only on notability. --MelanieN (talk) 04:01, 14 October 2016 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Your welcome &#124; Democratics Talk→  Be a guest 08:47, 17 October 2016 (UTC)  Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus. Relisting comment: moved to new log Your welcome &#124; Democratics Talk 11:28, 21 October 2016 (UTC)
 * Delete. purely trivial references, but no notability  DGG ( talk ) 02:05, 18 October 2016 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Your welcome &#124; <b style="color:blue">Democratics</b> <b style="color:red">Talk</b> 11:28, 21 October 2016 (UTC)
 * Delete A purely local business with no notability. <b style="color:#00FF00">MB</b> 00:00, 23 October 2016 (UTC)
 * Keep The brewery passes Notability based on the sources provided by . Cunard (talk) 06:31, 1 November 2016 (UTC)
 * Comment - I'll note the listed sources above are literally local event listings so as such they are not significant or independent outside of the interests of local visitors and citizens, therefore because there's no actual substance apart from such trivial information, they are not independently notable. Also, no, we cannot negotiate that "local event listings" are still major news because it would be the equivalent of saying a local businessman's interview with his local newspaper would be major independent news. SwisterTwister   talk  06:35, 1 November 2016 (UTC)
 * The articles are not merely "local event listings". The sources discuss the company's history and are brewery reviews. Cunard (talk) 06:40, 1 November 2016 (UTC)
 * From newspapers publishing information about such trivial awards, the reviews are still not actually focused as such, and "company history" is essentially advertising because that means the company is giving said information, something of which is expected since it's only a local news article, an excellent place for local advertising. Because none of these are outside of that, they are not substantial and therefore cannot be guaranteed to not be company-motivated advertising. See the secondwavemedia.com article for example:
 * Those two boys are today the men who are making Latitude 42 Brewing Company, at 7842 Portage Road in Portage, just north of East Centre Avenue, an instant success....(interviewed businesspeople) and then Doors to the new microbrewery open seven days a week, onto 11,000 square feet of space that includes at center a granite-topped bar, surrounded by handcrafted, tulip-wood tables and booths. Inside there is a capacity for 243 people, and the outdoor patio can hold another 90. A private dining room and 14-person brewmaster’s table are available for private parties. And a children’s play corner makes it clear: this is a place for families....(interviewed information again before scoping into building and company specifics such as the food specifications offered and what sizes they come in.....
 * Therefore that is clear advertising, because it not only begins with "such a family-fun place, it is located at....and while this beer is offered and this other beer is offered, it has 11,000 square feet, tulip-wood tables and booths, can hold 243 people and patio can have 90....". Honestly, that is advertising and that's not "substantial or notable information" nor should we accept it as such. To note, with all examining, the kalamazoocountry.com is literally a few thinly-tossed paragraphs about a trivial award and then finishing with "Congratulations to the company!". Yet again, this is not substantial nor should it be mistaken as such, and therefore they are local event listings, because like the secondwavemedia.com, it was not only republished advertising but literal advertising aimed at customers, and Wikipedia is not by means a business listing.
 * Take also articles about commercial establishments can only be promotional, but that is not true — it is ok for us to describe such subjects in factual terms and that's all our article does (yet the quoted selecivewavemedia.com specifically stated what the restaurant's size, capacities, food options, available seating options, etc. therefore that's advertising, not "encyclopedia information"), which states we can apparently accept advertised information simply because of the overall specifying, but that's not stating how WP:ADVERTISING (where it explicitly states advertising can and will be removed if unsuitable) and WP:NOT are not applying. Also, WP:GNG can be removed as applying when WP:ADVERTISING and WP:NOT, which are large and firm when it comes to removing unsuitable information, especially when such company-advertising blatancy is offered as "significant news". SwisterTwister   talk  07:08, 1 November 2016 (UTC)


 * Redirect to List of breweries in Michigan per WP:TOOSOON; not enough in-depth coverage to warrant a stand-alone article at this time. K.e.coffman (talk) 08:39, 1 November 2016 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.