Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Les Cahiers Fashion Marketing


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   delete. – Juliancolton  &#124; Talk 13:43, 25 October 2009 (UTC)

Les Cahiers Fashion Marketing

 * – (View AfD) (View log)

Non-notable publication Pontificalibus (talk) 13:59, 17 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Delete. Extremely unlikely for a magazine launched last year to be notable already, and this doesn't look like any exception. Chris Neville-Smith (talk) 14:39, 17 October 2009 (UTC)


 * Writer Response: This is a company profile for Les Cahiers Fashion Marketing. It is indeed a notable European publication (and you would know if you were involved in the European fashion industry), even though it only began in 2008. The purpose is to share facts about the company, and I plan to expand the article to include date of inception, editor in chief, website, topics covered, etc. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Slcatino (talk • contribs) 15:59, 17 October 2009 (UTC)
 * "You would know if you were involved in the European fashion industry" isn't good enough. Show us coverage of this magazine in independent, reliable third-party publications and the article might qualify for notability. If the facts about the company are not publicly available anywhere else, it does not belong on Wikipedia. Chris Neville-Smith (talk) 16:04, 17 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Delete unless better references are produced to bolster the assertions of notability. This is a specialised field, so I would not expect a vast flood of ghits. I find they are booked for the Feria Valencia (who can't spell Autumn, but that's irrelevant), and you seem to be able to order or download the magazine at http://www.hoepli.it/libro/les-cahiers-fashion-marketing-jun-jul-aug-2009-trimestrale-anno-numero-3.asp?ib=9772036312006&pc=000005004008000 (My Italian is not what it was - over to someone whose still is...) Apart from that, twitter, linkedin and similar looking places. Something more is required. Peridon (talk) 17:08, 17 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Writer Response: LCFM is carried in Hoepli in Milan (Hoepli is a publisher and independent bookstore since 1870, one of the most authoritative in Italy), as well as Libreria Rizzoli (one of the leading publishers in Italy). Both of these have their own wikipedia pages, Ulrico Hoepli and Angelo Rizzoli. LCFM is also distributed in Fashion Room, an independent bookstore in Italy and the official bookstore of Pitti Immagine in Florence (the organizer of the biggest international exhibition in the fashion sector). I admit that the publication is created for a very niche market, but this niche is in demand and has caught the attention of fashion professors and students, as well as management in fashion companies. The type of information that the magazine provides is not readily available from other sources. Is there something specific you would like me to change or add to make this article more suitable?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Slcatino (talk • contribs) 18:48, 17 October 2009 (UTC)
 * See Chris Neville-Smith's remark above about independent reliable sources. We're not doubting the magazine exists. Wikipedia cannot list everything, so there must be a level of notability established. Self-published or self-edited sources only come in for extra info. They are not establishers of anything. (Wikipedia cannot be used as a source either, because it's open to edit!) There must be some references to the magazine somewhere - you are more likely to know than me. I'm working on two sites and researching a book at the moment - so back to you... Peridon (talk)
 * Unfortunately, if it's a niche publication you'll have trouble establishing notability this early on. I hope you'll understand that Wikipedia is deluged by people trying to promote their new publications with a Wikipedia page, and everybody claims their publication grabs the attention of someone, therefore all claims to notability have to be verifiable. However, that's not to say this magazine will never be notable. A good example is You Me At Six. This band originally failed a deletion discussion in spite of the claims that they were on the way up. A few months later, they appeared on the front cover of NME, and then they did get their article back. If you can't prove notability now, I suggest keeping an eye out for coverage in the future, and coming back if and when that appears. Chris Neville-Smith (talk) 10:45, 18 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Writer Response: Thank you for these comments, now I understand what notable sources you are looking for. We have not been mentioned in other major publications yet that can be linked on the web, but we have letters of praise from Politecnico di Milano and Camera della Moda in Milan. The Italian company ALTEREGO mentions our first issue in their website ALTEREGO, as well as ATELIER98 ATELIER and Polimoda |tmp|hwtemp|3se4adb0837092.tmp/d1/fvis Polimoda. However, if these are not enough I will keep my eye out for coverage that is more suitable for wikipedia. Perhaps this publication does not yet meet the criteria for the Company section of wikipedia, but can it be placed under Books or Magazines? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Slcatino (talk • contribs) 12:25, 18 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Merge?: If you have a relationship to an entity which is on wiki and meets criteria ( will not be deleted as soon as someone examines it ) then for now you can probably move this information into the existing articles. Additional details about notable subjects can come from self-cites but they can't establish notability ( that anyone else cares). Obscure topics come up all the time, I use IEEE versus MTV as my standard comparison :) IEEE papers may come up on gscholar but I don't know where gfashion is although may be an interesting notion for people exploring image search/indexing :) Nerdseeksblonde (talk) 12:30, 18 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Fashion-related deletion discussions. Thryduulf (talk) 13:20, 18 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Delete Based on the argument of the writer, it seems to be a case of not yet notable. Sicatino even at the end admits it is not notable as a company.   DGG ( talk ) 01:36, 20 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Writer Response: It's not that this magazine is not notable, but the further sources we can provide are not in a form that can be represented through wikipedia (actual letters, etc.). What is the criteria for a book or magazine to be part of wikipedia? LCFM is published and available in bookstores around the world. Slcatino (talk) 11:48, 21 October 2009 (UTC)
 * You need to meet the General Notability guideline. (There are notability guidelines for companies and books, but they don't really say anything extra.) Sources generally have to be publicly accessible, though not necessarily online. (If you have coverage in other magazines, that would count in your favour whether or not they are online - it's just that it will be more work to prove the coverage exists.) If this article gets deleted, you could probably request the article to be copied to your userspace and wait for further coverage to appear. If the magazine will become as notable as you believe, the sources will come. Chris Neville-Smith (talk) 16:41, 21 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Delete, it has only 26 Google hits with Wikipedia included. Abductive  (reasoning) 03:45, 25 October 2009 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.