Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of Forgotten Realms characters


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was merge to Forgotten Realms. —&thinsp;JJMC89&thinsp; (T·C) 07:50, 29 March 2020 (UTC)

List of Forgotten Realms characters

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List of runaway fancruft that is largely sourced to WP:PRIMARY sources if not original research. Fails WP:LISTN and is WP:ALLPLOT. There does not seem to be a particular reason this merits a list rather than the few actually major characters being described at Forgotten Realms instead, as the vast majority do not appear notable, and ones that are, like Drizzt Do'Urden, already have an article. ZXCVBNM (TALK) 05:09, 10 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Fictional elements-related deletion discussions. ZXCVBNM (TALK) 05:09, 10 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Science fiction and fantasy-related deletion discussions. ZXCVBNM (TALK) 05:09, 10 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Games-related deletion discussions. ZXCVBNM (TALK) 05:09, 10 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Lists-related deletion discussions. ZXCVBNM (TALK) 05:09, 10 March 2020 (UTC)


 * Jarlaxle, Wulfgar_(Forgotten_Realms), Drizzt Do'Urden, Elminster, Erevis Cale, and Mordenkainen are the only ones I see with links to their own articles.   D r e a m Focus  23:53, 10 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete - The individual series and novel articles can easily describe their own characters within in-article summaries or lists. This must be drawing from at least 100 novels. There is no benefit to the general reader here. It's a fan-list. TTN (talk) 17:04, 12 March 2020 (UTC)
 * delete - mostly things that no third party has ever found any worth in mentioning other than a passing reference to the existence of the name as a character in a book. isnt there a fan wiki for this type of stuff? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.220.13.88 (talk) 22:40, 13 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Merge and redirect to Forgotten Realms: The various characters populating the Forgotten Realms are obiously one key factor of the setting, and so far the main article simply refers here. If this list is not simply kept (it is already a merge target for other articles), a proper section is needed there, and this list can be the basis for it. There are secondary sources in this article, too, and the content based on that at the least should not be lost. As far as I have seen, these parts are not covered by the separate articles for the most major characters already mentioned. The redirect and thus page history should be kept even though this is not a common redirect, as persumably more secondary sources are out there at least in the form of novel reviews, and then content can be reactivated.
 * Or the article could be kept and all characters where no secondary sources have been found yet could be hidden until they have.
 * Lastly, as transfer of content to a fan wiki has been mentioned here and in many other AfDs: As the article views show this page is of some interest to users of Wikipedia, despite the misgivings about notability. Could you please help me out and help point interested users to the Forgotten Realms fan wiki here in the interest of improving usability of Wikipedia? Daranios (talk) 14:36, 14 March 2020 (UTC)

--I see a claim of "reliable sources" - where and what exactly are these sources? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.220.13.88 (talk) 16:14, 17 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Redirect per Daranios, as such runaway list become major fancruft problems. But some characters from that franchise merit a mention, and the franchise is notable. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 08:17, 15 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Keep or merge to Forgotten Realms per above comments since there are WP:RS to retain, per WP:PRESERVE and WP:ATD. BOZ (talk) 12:13, 15 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Well, what's in the references and is not a primary source. I am not sure about UGO Entertainment and encrucijada.net, though. There are books (To Be Continued: An Annotated Guide to Sequels, Magill's Guide to Science Fiction and Fantasy Literature, Dragonlore: From the Archives of the Grey School of Wizardry), magazines (Kliatt, GameSpy, Arcane), and a review on rpg.net, which again one can discuss about but which I have found reliable so far. There are also some additional secondary sources which are not independent, however. Daranios (talk) 19:38, 17 March 2020 (UTC)

---so at best like 8 of the entries have valid sources, although i think at least 3 of the sources are for a single entry Bruenor and one of the sources is merely "Here is a summary of the book Bruenor and Drzzt go on adventures together." the case that "there are sources so it should be kept" is whimsically flimsy if we assume good intent, otherwise it would appear to be purposefully deceptive. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.220.13.88 (talk) 16:59, 26 March 2020 (UTC)
 * I don't quite understand, could you please explain that more? Are you referring to the one source you linked, with regard to Bruenor? But it's great you did link it, because now I see there that To be Continued: An Annotated Guide to Sequels has more on other characters on p. 251 which is not yet worked into this article, and probably more on other pages. Daranios (talk) 11:53, 27 March 2020 (UTC)

---My point is that a "keep there are sources" is, on its face, a super strong argument. but if you are making such a claim when of the hundred odd entries in the list, only 6 have actual third party sources and a "source"   is merely a passing mention of the name in a single sentence plot summary, (ie it is the very embodiment of "Martin Walker's statement, in a newspaper article about Bill Clinton,[1] that "In high school, he was part of a jazz band called Three Blind Mice" is plainly a trivial mention of that band.") then the "keep there are sources" is not an argument that should be considered at its face value. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.220.13.88 (talk) 14:22, 28 March 2020 (UTC)  Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Selective Merge to Forgotten Realms - Most of these entries are either non-notable or do not have independent sourcing. But, there are several of them that do have a bit of sourcing, and several of them that are legitimate blue links to other articles.  These characters can be easily handled in the appropriate section of the main Forgotten Realms article.  Alternatively, we can keep this article, and just do a large-scale pruning, so only the characters that have legitimate, secondary sourcing are included.  I am fine with either option.  Rorshacma (talk) 20:37, 17 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Merge to Forgotten Realms. Goustien (talk) 15:07, 20 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Selective Merge as per Rorshacma above. Cheers, 1292simon (talk) 02:33, 21 March 2020 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, xinbenlv  Talk, Remember to "ping" me 05:29, 21 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Selective Merge, whatever is appropriate to Forgotten Realms. The amount of characters who deserve to be mentioned there can easily be contained in the main article, with no need for a split like this that contains massive amounts of unreferenced in-universe material. Devonian Wombat (talk) 07:59, 21 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete or Redirect as per Piotrus Chetsford (talk) 15:21, 21 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Selective merge per above. Shivkarandholiya12 (talk) 06:02, 26 March 2020 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.