Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of Instant Game Collection games (North America) (2nd nomination)


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. The WP:NOT concerns are clearly stated and the argument to keep material because some editors find it useful is not generally accepted at AfD. For those who do find the content useful, note that one of the participants has transferred these lists to Fandom here. RL0919 (talk) 22:31, 14 January 2020 (UTC)

List of Instant Game Collection games (North America)
AfDs for this article: 
 * – ( View AfD View log  Stats )

Per previous deletions of "list of games temporarily offered for free on a games' service" per (Articles for deletion/List of Games with Gold games (2nd nomination) and Articles for deletion/List of free Epic Games Store games, and Articles for deletion/List of Humble Bundles (2nd nomination)) these pages fail WP:NOT. A complete list of games available for a platform is fine, but outlining those games that were free at one point off this storefront is not appropriate. M asem (t) 20:02, 7 January 2020 (UTC) I am also nominating the following related pages because they are part of the same series of Instant Game Collections in different regions:


 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Video games-related deletion discussions. M asem  (t) 20:02, 7 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Lists-related deletion discussions. Shellwood (talk) 20:09, 7 January 2020 (UTC)


 * Delete all. Clear failure of WP:NOTCATALOGUE and most sourcing is self-published. These lists have no place for an encyclopedia. Ajf773 (talk) 20:30, 7 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete all per nom and WP:NOTCATALOGUE. Sergecross73   msg me  20:42, 7 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete all as stated above; NOTCATALOG pretty much hits the nail on the head. Red Phoenix  talk  21:23, 7 January 2020 (UTC)
 * In addition, I suggest the following to be nominated as well as they transclude to the PAL article: (list truncated and moved to nomination header, but leaving example given - Masem): List of Instant Game Collection games (PAL region, 2010). Ajf773 (talk) 21:45, 7 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Thanks, these have all been appropriately tagged and added. I have refactored that list up to the nomination header to keep this clean. --M asem (t) 21:52, 7 January 2020 (UTC)


 * Delete all per nom and other's reasoning. ~ Dissident93 (talk) 22:20, 7 January 2020 (UTC)


 * Keep I would like to raise an objection to any further deletions of all these lists (particularly the "games temporarily free" lists). Whilst I do see that it is debatable whether or not Wikipedia should be indexing such information, I do think it deserves to have *some* place on the Internet. A lot of work has gone into making these lists and stands to be lost. Why not have a separate website established that can index this information (or even as part of a catalogue listing) so that this information can be saved in an easy to access place, and THEN delete them from Wikipedia? As it stands, people are using these lists as a reference (typically by typing into a search engine, for example 'list of games with gold games') without actually understanding what exactly an "encyclopedia" is intended to be, and stand to lose out! Many games on these lists are eventually removed permanently from sales due to copyright licence expiration. Proof that they were even offered at one point is useful from an archiving perspective as someone who previously downloaded such games usually can obtain them so long as they purchased them (be it free or at cost) from their own account (via PSN, Microsoft Store, etc). Many of these pages, as stated, have existed for years. The only reason they have been brought to attention for deletion is because one publisher is listing a game for free *daily*. I can entirely understand why it might seem absurd for, let's say 365 games in a worst case scenario, to be listed with per-year wiki pages. All the same, I think the information should be made available *somewhere* and a proper debate that the public can actually notice is going on should be held (several pages deep on Wikipedia should *NOT* count because the vast majority of people do not dig this deep in my experience, especially right after the festive season!) For now, please don't delete any further lists. Samspin 0410, 8 January (GMT).
 * Please see Wikipedia:Alternative outlets because there are places where content deemed not suitable for Wikipedia can find a home so to speak. If you believe it does deserve to be found online somewhere, you can copy the content found in the article onto some other website. As long as you properly attribute the source as Wikipedia, you're free to do that. Even if this article ends up deleted, the attribution will still be valid and acceptable per Wikipedia's licensing terms even if the article is no longer publicly visible. Moreover, some websites like Wikia even use similar software for their pages so you may not have to do any major reformatting, and their policies/guidelines tend to be less restrictive which will might make it easier to add more content. There are pretty much always options available other than trying to use Wikipedia as a free web host. -- Marchjuly (talk) 06:33, 8 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Might Wikidata be a decent home for this information as well? Axem Titanium (talk) 19:49, 8 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete fails LISTN. Should be moved to an alternative outlet. buidhe 10:10, 8 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete all per nom.  Spy-cicle💥   Talk? 16:04, 8 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Request SNOW close Someone clearly has it out for these articles and everyone seems to agree. Let's just get it over with. -- McDoob  AU93  18:25, 8 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete per WP:MILL, WP:NOTWEBHOST, and WP:SNOW. There's over 600 games of this type. Why is this here? Bearian (talk) 21:08, 10 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Keep Hello. You could say that I'm the maintainer of these lists over at the PAL region since 2017. The reason why I keep them updated is to know what game I would loose if I choose to cancel my PS+ subscription, since there is no information from Sony (that I'm aware of) if a game in your possession have been obtained via PS+ or not. It's also a great source of information when you talk to friends about a specific game and can point out that if you had PS+ around this date you should have the game. A few Twitch streamers use the list as a "Project PS+", where they stream games obtained via PS+. Like The Mexican Runner did with NESMania, where he streamed all games from the NES. If these lists are to be deleted so would I like to have them somewhere else, but where? Could List of PlayStation 3 games, List of PlayStation 4 games and List of PlayStation Vita games with an added "PS+" column be a good alternative? Ragowit (talk) 13:40, 11 January 2020 (UTC)
 * There are other wikis that you could transfer the information to that would probably love to have it. You can request to WP:Userfy the pages prior to deletion so you have more time to copy it, if needed. Axem Titanium (talk) 19:56, 11 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete per nom, WP:NOTNEWS, and WP:SUSTAINED. ミラP 16:49, 11 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Keep. The value of these lists may not be apparent to non-gamers, but this is a perfectly fair use of Wikipedia (similar to listing which games are included in a collection or bundled with a system) and is definitely not a catalog (having no prices or purchase links). The deletion review for the corresponding XBox Games With Gold list stirred a fair bit of controversy and I think everyone would be best served by taking a step back and asking "what negative precedent do we set for Wikipedia by maintaining this content?" vs. "who is harmed if we pull down this non-commercial, non-political, non-controversial (until the deletion proposals) page that many people seem to find valuable?" I might be missing something, but I don't see these lists as a violation of the letter or spirit of any of Wikipedia's community standards, and they absolutely are useful. ChillThyself (talk) 21:27, 12 January 2020 (UTC)
 * These are lists of temporary sales for games (being available for free). That fails NOT#CATALOG. We don't list sales and promotions like this, unless they themselves are notable (For example, Rocket League was made available for free on the PS4 and that lead to a huge number of new players that helped to improve the game's reception -- which we document on that page. Not true of every game on these lists.) --M asem (t) 21:57, 12 January 2020 (UTC)
 * As a major contributor of these lists over the years, I have taken the step of copying them to a wiki dedicated to PlayStation. This is a work in progress mind as certain things don’t translate perfectly from Wikipedia to Wikia/Fandom. For those interested, please find them here. Thanks. —Dell9300 (talk) 09:46, 12 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete all Per WP:NOTCATALOGUE. The transwiki to Fandom seems like the right move.ZXCVBNM (TALK) 07:45, 13 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete As Wikipedia is not a catalogue, but we can to move some of the content to other existing Wikipedia articles. Ambrosiawater (talk) 20:26, 13 January 2020 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it.</b> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.