Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of National Football League teams that finished last before first


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. &spades;PMC&spades; (talk) 04:03, 6 July 2018 (UTC)

List of National Football League teams that finished last before first

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Random list that has no notability as a cohesive group. Per WP:LISTN, "a list topic is considered notable is if it has been discussed as a group or set by independent reliable sources." This obviously does not meet that standard. « Gonzo fan2007 '' (talk)  @ 20:43, 28 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Note to closing admin, if the discussion results in deletion, please speedy delete the redirects National Football League: Last to first, National Football League: Last to First, and NFL: Last to First as well. « Gonzo fan2007  '' (talk)  @ 04:53, 29 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Organizations-related deletion discussions. cinco deL3X1  ◊distænt write◊  21:06, 28 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of American football-related deletion discussions. cinco deL3X1  ◊distænt write◊  21:06, 28 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Lists-related deletion discussions. cinco deL3X1  ◊distænt write◊  21:06, 28 June 2018 (UTC)


 * Delete per nomination. And what about the teams that finished first before last? -The Gnome (talk) 22:44, 28 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete - this comes across as original research. Vorbee (talk) 08:17, 29 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Reluctant keep. This is actually filler material for articles between seasons, like now, when sports writers are desperate for something to write about, so there are actual sources. However, the ungrammatical title needs to be fixed. Clarityfiend (talk) 08:24, 29 June 2018 (UTC)
 * I thought "filler" material was by definition non-notable. AKA "silly season" material. -The Gnome (talk) 15:54, 29 June 2018 (UTC)


 * Comment : Seriously, we have to take into account the list's inherent lack of notability. This is American football. As in most professional sports in America, the National Football League system is set up in such a way that, after the season is over, the worst teams get materially rewarded, e.g. through getting top draft-picks, etc. The NFL actively promotes the equal dispersion of power so that the league remains interesting and attractive and profitable. Hence the relative rarity of "dynasties."
 * Moreover, there's a very short distance between a bad season and a good season, something that makes last-to-first not very "unexpected," when we're talking about a set (division) with only four members (teams). There are 16 games in total in the regular season for every team. In a league of 32 teams in total they are too few for a valid, statistical result. It's not a round robin; each team gets to play every other team in their own conference once every three years, and every team in the other conference exactly once every four years.
 * Let's take the hypothetical season-result of 8-8 for the average team. Well, for example, the 2015 Washington Redskins won only one more game than the hypothetical expectation, finishing 9-7, and ended up 1st in their division; that's just one game won more than the games lost. Same thing with the 2007 Buccaneers, or, going back to 1990, the Bengals. The 2013 Eagles, the 2012 Redskins, the 2010 Chiefs, the 2006 Eagles (it goes on) only had to win 2 games more than the games they lost to top their division. It's not a statistical or sports surprise, really, that this story ("from-rags-to-riches") is repeated practically every year. Yet someone in the article sounds amazed: "[For the last fifteen years] at least one team has gone from last place to first place in their division in the span of just one season," they write. Yeah, and the Pope prayed today. Make a note of it. Or a list. -The Gnome (talk) 16:46, 29 June 2018 (UTC)


 * Delete there might be some off-season discussion of the topic that approaches WP:GNG, but I'm going with ignore all rules and argue that removal of this list makes Wikipedia better. There may indeed be a large amount of discussion among the sports talking heads in the off-season, but trying to assemble any data on the topic just comes across as forced trivia.  Let consensus prevail.--Paul McDonald (talk) 18:07, 29 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete currently WP:OR, and would be trivia even if properly sourced. power~enwiki ( π, ν ) 17:46, 4 July 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete I don't see any use of this list as such. Dial911 (talk) 17:01, 5 July 2018 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.