Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of North Korean terrorist attacks


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep‎__EXPECTED_UNCONNECTED_PAGE__. There is a consensus to Keep this article. I recommend that, in the future, the nominator present a more coherent, well thought-out deletion rationale that demonstrates BEFORE. Discussion about a page move and changing the article title can occur on the article talk page. Liz Read! Talk! 01:46, 8 March 2024 (UTC)

List of North Korean terrorist attacks

 * – ( View AfD View log | edits since nomination)

What is a terrorist attack and what is not cannot be determined neutrally, besides there are no sources and the article seems to be of no use. Youprayteas talk/contribs 18:10, 26 February 2024 (UTC)


 * Delete article fails WP:NPOV and has a list that can't be measured objectively. Not a good start, but i'm surprised North Korea and state-sponsored terrorism is not an article. -1ctinus📝  🗨  18:14, 26 February 2024 (UTC)


 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Lists-related deletion discussions.  CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 18:45, 26 February 2024 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of North Korea-related deletion discussions.  CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 18:46, 26 February 2024 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of South Korea-related deletion discussions.  CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 18:46, 26 February 2024 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Terrorism-related deletion discussions.  CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 18:46, 26 February 2024 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Events-related deletion discussions.  CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 18:46, 26 February 2024 (UTC)
 * Keep Category:Terrorism committed by North Korea exist, and list are more useful than categories since you can get more information and find what you are looking for. I added references easily found in the articles linked to.   D r e a m Focus  19:25, 26 February 2024 (UTC)
 * Delete per . I'm not convinced by ' argument: in my view, provides a perfectly suitable navigational function for these kinds of terrorist attacks (and it's not like there are dozens of attacks in this list that require summaries to navigate), while a separate list article invites WP:NPOV or rash summaries about suspected but not confirmed attacks. If the article North Korea and state-sponsored terrorism existed, it would be the obvious redirect. "[Country X] and state-sponsored terrorism" seems to be the standard title format for discussing these topics: I couldn't find other list-articles entitled "List of terrorist attacks by [country]" or "List of [nationality] terrorist attacks". Editors interested in pursuing a WP:ATD should try to create North Korea and state-sponsored terrorism; there is plenty that can be incorporated from State Sponsors of Terrorism (U.S. list). IgnatiusofLondon (talk) 19:51, 26 February 2024 (UTC)
 * Category:Terrorism committed by country and Category:State-sponsored terrorism do exist.  D r e a m Focus  20:10, 26 February 2024 (UTC)
 * Yes, but not list articles. IgnatiusofLondon (talk) 21:21, 26 February 2024 (UTC)
 * Keep and move to North Korea and state-sponsored terrorism. The AfD discussion hasn't alleviated my concerns about WP:NPOV, but it seems like deletion would only exacerbate Wikipedia's surprising lack of coverage on the subject, and this move to a more appropriate page title and article format can at least encourage editors to continue improving said coverage. IgnatiusofLondon (talk) 21:09, 7 March 2024 (UTC)


 * Keep. Sources have been found on the current topic. WP:AFDISNOTCLEANUP. I believe it passes WP:NLIST. Conyo14 (talk) 21:14, 26 February 2024 (UTC)
 * Keep The topic is notable. Deletion is not a solution for this. Orientls (talk) 04:50, 27 February 2024 (UTC)
 * Keep – With perhaps a name change to: List of terrorist attacks attributed to North Korea. Svartner (talk) 10:44, 27 February 2024 (UTC)
 * Keep. At best this should be a rename discussion, not a deletion. And if your impression is that we can basically never call anything on Wikipedia "terrorism" because it's hard to define, you're not quite correct. Read MOS:TERRORIST. We follow what most reliable sources say. toobigtokale (talk) 11:16, 27 February 2024 (UTC)


 * Comment User:IgnatiusofLondon's concerns about the list format are valid. Reviewing previous AFDs for lists of terrorist incidents, the consensus is nearly always to keep, apart from the few lists based on ideological category (right-wing/left-wing, etc), which tend to get deleted. NK is something of a corner case though; there's no state quite like it in modern history. WP:LISTCRIT would need to be chosen with care: if NK abruptly test-launches a new weapon in the Sea of Japan, people are terrorized. Was it terrorism, or was it a weapons test? Reliable sources may diverge on the answer, and MOS:TERRORIST doesn't address this. User:IgnatiusofLondon's idea of an article, rather than a list, would be my preferred solution. Waiting for further comment before deciding whether to "keep and rename". Wikishovel (talk) 12:05, 27 February 2024 (UTC)
 * To my understanding, MOS:TERRORIST imo would address the nature of a weapons test: we'd follow what RS would say. If they describe it as terrorism, we'd call it the same. If not, then not. toobigtokale (talk) 20:55, 7 March 2024 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz Read! Talk! 23:22, 4 March 2024 (UTC)
 * Keep. Per WP:CLNT, lists shouldn't be deleted because you prefer categories. Also, the table is somewhat more informative. Better Nuncio (talk) 10:21, 3 March 2024 (UTC)
 * It's not merly a preference but a belief a category is more appropriate than a list here — it protects against WP:NOV and other concerns that list articles, as more directly editable pages, facilitate more easily than categories, especially on an article likely to attract politicised commentary. I'd understand the "somewhat more informative" argument if there were dozens of entries on the list, but there aren't. IgnatiusofLondon (talk) 22:44, 3 March 2024 (UTC)
 *  Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Keep: There have been sources added so this article is no longer unsourced. I heavily disagree with the idea that "What is a terrorist attack and what is not cannot be determined neutrally" as there have been tons of reliable sources on this topic, not to mention all of the other Wikipedia article in this topic area. Swordman97  talk to me 03:48, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
 * The difference is that the other Wikipedia article in this topic area aren't list-articles. Lists invite WP:NPOV concerns for attacks and attributions that cannot be delicately and objectively discussed. If an editor tomorrow created List of terrorist attacks by the United Kingdom, I'm sure the AfD discussion would conclude in a merge to United Kingdom and state-sponsored terrorism, and likewise for every other country. What's avoiding a deletion here is that North Korea and state-sponsored terrorism doesn't exist, so there is no suitable redirect target. IgnatiusofLondon (talk) 21:06, 7 March 2024 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.