Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of Turkish dramatists and playwrights


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.  

The result was DELETE ALL. It is very clear that these are considered over-granular and superfluous to their categories. (Note that cats+lists together are retained at times, but rarely at such a superfine granularity as this). Procedurally, it is a bit unfortunate that there was an expansion of the nomination partway through, but it has clearly not made any difference to those who came afterwards since everyone was very well aware that there was a long list of articles being considered at once whenever they personally arrived at they AfD. As such, the AfD could be viewed as being closed on the 'before' nomination and 'before' deletes and then the 'after' nomination and the 'after' deletes and the outcome would be the same. Otoh, we could just recognise a consensus when we see one... -Splash - tk 19:18, 17 November 2007 (UTC)

List of Turkish dramatists and playwrights

 * – (View AfD) (View log)

These were all mostly deprodded (seemingly in bad faith, but WP:PROD says that ain't no excuse to revert). They're all perfect examples of WP:LISTCRUFT, and are all redundant to corresponding categories. Closedmouth 02:59, 11 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Comment I have added many more similar pages to this AfD which I believe can appropriately be considered under the same discussion. I found them on Ozipozi's contributions — people can check it out to see if I missed any. I did not list articles which had any content beyond category-listing; those can be probably be handled best in seperate AfD(s). Going to go nurse the carpal tunnel now. — Swpbtalk.edits 04:18, 12 November 2007 (UTC)

The rest:




 * Delete, per nom. Thanks, Codelyoko193 (T/C) 03:04, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Delete All: Wow. - Rjd0060 05:25, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Close and relist separately While I will agree that a number of these are crufty, several are not. It's about half-and-half, I'd say. It's impossible to judge the non-crufty ones by their merits (or even the crufty ones, as that is somewhat a matter of perspective) in a mass-nom like this. LaMenta3 05:41, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Delete all which have corresponding categories. There is absolutely no reason to have this kind of duplication. Period. — Swpbtalk.edits 06:08, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Delete all I came across these pages about a week ago when new page patrolling. I saved them in a "check back" folder in the possibility of taking these to AfD or seeing how it progressed. Now I see they are already here. The category easily supersedes these pages. It's an unnecessary duplication of information. Spellcast 08:04, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Delete all, 100 % pointless, fails WP:LIST. Except maybe List of Turkish delegates to major international contests and List of Turkish people of Bulgarian descent. Punkmorten 11:26, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Keep the following:
 * List of Turkish Cartoonists includes some entries that were not in the corresponding category. Those need to be categorized.
 * Now all categorized. — Swpbtalk.edits 17:42, 12 November 2007 (UTC)
 * List of Turkish people of Bulgarian descent has a few red links and should be kept for now.
 * List of Turkish delegates to major international contests has a few red links and should be kept for now.
 * List of Turkish winners of Miss Europe has no corresponding category.
 * Corresponding category Category:Turkish winners of Miss Europe now exists, and all members have been categorized. — Swpbtalk.edits 17:49, 12 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Delete the remainder as they are duplicates of existing categories and add nothing new. Phew, what a pain. &mdash; RJH (talk) 19:19, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Delete superfluous lists. RMHED 19:35, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Keep, lists are not redundant to categorizes, they are complementary. Lists can contain other sorting than alphabetic, or can contain additional information that is not present in categories. Should be expanded rather than deleted. And no, it is NOT Wikipedia policy to remove list-only articles that replicate categories. --Cpt. Morgan (Reinoutr) 21:47, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
 * You could also say, "And no, it is NOT Wikipedia policy to keep list-only articles that replicate categories. RMHED 00:45, 12 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Lists which contain information beyond what a category contains have been specifically excluded from this AfD. — Swpbtalk.edits 17:52, 12 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Delete all Just collections of links, which Wikipedia articles are not. The category not yet existing and certain members not being included in the category are not reasons to keep the lists. Jay32183 03:33, 12 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Delete almost all as per RJH, excepting the four three that RJH lists. - TexasAndroid 14:15, 12 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Delete all. This is not the way we organise biographical articles. Sandstein 19:05, 13 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Delete all we have categories for these - these lists appear to be nothing but copy and paste jobs from the cats. Carlossuarez46 22:38, 13 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Keep all There are some I would not mind being deleted, but there are some that should stay, as I pointed below, I cannot check them all. Please list separately the ones that should be listed. I have some concerns.
 * The scope of this AFD changed dramatically midway (after most of the votes were cast). If you wish, we can remove the articles added. If not, we should relist this AFD or ask the closing admins to close it a bit later than usual.
 * I won't be checking all articles, but unlike suggested above, I know that List of Turkish composers is not a duplication, if that matters. From WP:LIST: "Lists and categories have different properties, and having both a list and a similar category is not necessarily redundant."
 * I am planning to move Turks_in_Germany to List of Turkish Germans. By the time you read this, the move might be complete.
 * Especially, the lists related to ethnicities are useful, if they are complete enough, they can stay, imo.
 * These lists seem to be intended to be sublists of List of Turkish people, which was quite large. Please see this diff of 98 recent edits, most of them by Ozipozi, whose other edits were inspected above. I don't know him, but from his talk page, I know Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/İsmet_Güney. He seems to not improve the articles he created immediately, but do so later.
 * It would be best if someone added these to Wikipedia:WikiProject Deletion sorting/Turkey and/or mentioned the AFD on Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Turkey. Some might be willing to immediately expand some of the lists, like I will do to List of Turkish Germans. Lastly, if the rationale is duplication by a category, I did not like Category:Turkish winners of Miss Europe being created so that we can apply this rationale. DenizTC 23:15, 13 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Comment I have withdrawn List of Turkish Germans from the nomination per Deniz. It is my belief that it is acceptable to withdraw the article from the nomination this far into the AfD because the clear majority of arguments for deletion are based on the lists being nothing more than category duplicates, something this article is now clearly not. — Swpbtalk.edits 02:25, 14 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Delete all. The lists I checked are sorted lexicographically or not at all and do not provide much of context. Categories are sufficient here.
 * I oppose closing the AfD and splitting it into dozens of individual AfDs - it is very annoying for the people who do not care about the problem. Possible solution is to create a single separated page structured so people could vote either en-bloc or per item. Pavel Vozenilek 12:12, 15 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Delete all. Agree per above, listcruft. Categories are sufficient here.Voorlandt (talk) 09:45, 17 November 2007 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.