Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of current United Kingdom MPs


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was withdrawn. DrKiernan (talk) 13:45, 19 November 2012 (UTC)

List of current United Kingdom MPs

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 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of United Kingdom-related deletion discussions.
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Lists of people-related deletion discussions. — Richardguk (talk) 01:02, 12 November 2012 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Lists of people-related deletion discussions. — Richardguk (talk) 01:02, 12 November 2012 (UTC)

Substantial duplication of lists in Category:Lists of UK MPs 2010–. Besides which, this page, in its current form, will be so long if completed that it will almost certainly exceed the template limits of the wiki software, meaning that much of the bottom half will be unreadable. That's one reason why the lists are split into the different lists in the UK 2010 MPs category. DrKiernan (talk) 15:53, 11 November 2012 (UTC)
 * Comment The issue of the template limits could be fixed easily enough by dividing the list into a series of tables based on, for instance, party or alphabet. Keresaspa (talk) 19:14, 11 November 2012 (UTC)
 * That was one of my points: the existing pages already do this for parties and country. DrKiernan (talk) 21:13, 11 November 2012 (UTC)


 * Weak keep: My initial reaction was that the page should be deleted because it is so similar to List of MPs elected in the United Kingdom general election, 2010 (which already has a separate section for post-2010 by-election changes). And, with the topical but unusual exception of the November 2012 by-elections caused mainly by one-off police commissioner candidate resignations, UK parliamentary by-elections have been relatively rare since the average age of MPs greatly reduced over a decade ago. But on looking at Category:Lists of UK MPs 2010–, it is clear that editors are already willing (and presumably able) to maintain 8 other list pages that essentially reproduce substantial subsets of the main 2010 list page. Casual readers are more likely to be interested in the current MPs than those elected a while ago (though the new list ought to have clear annotations against vacant seats and by-election winners, noting the name of the 2010 MP whom they replaced). And the new list is the only full UK list to provide a direct alphabetical link to the current MP for constituencies that have had by-elections since the last general election. Unless someone can show that the other overlapping MP lists are unmaintainable, it seems sensible to keep this page and might avoid confusion among readers who don't realise that the main table on the existing pages is not entirely current; they might well not notice the unstructured text in the notes column, or the by-election section which is easily overlooked because the main list is so long. (If the page is retained, the list can easily be completed by copy-pasting the list from the main 2010 page and manually adjusting the seats that have had by-elections, instead of compiling the entire list from scratch. That should be much easier than the current approach which has left the new list mostly incomplete a week after its creation. I have already demonstrated on the new page how lists such as this can be made more sortable; see also List of postcode districts in the United Kingdom for an example of a fully sortable long list with TOC-style links using Anchor.) — Richardguk (talk) 00:09, 12 November 2012 (UTC)
 * Keep I have sympathy with the deletion request, but ultimately this content is notable, and can be used to produce an index within the wider UK politics project. There is clearly an issue with its 'orphan' status but this can be easily resolved. doktorb wordsdeeds 03:22, 12 November 2012 (UTC)
 * Keep for me. I know little about tables (here or outside - I'm much more used to spreadsheets and computer typesetting), but the way the info is presented is accessible and easy to use for the visitor. By-elections may become more frequent despite the age of MPs getting lower - until they get the hang of honesty in accounting, and for certain other reasons... Peridon (talk) 10:30, 12 November 2012 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Politics-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 13:46, 12 November 2012 (UTC)


 * Merge (without keeping a redirect)-- This list is duplicating another article. It is incomplete.  It is structured ina  way that will need continual maintenance.  This makes is very unsatisfactory.  If the article has additional information, that can usefully be merged, but the length of service will change every day and is not a useful addition.  Peterkingiron (talk) 17:54, 13 November 2012 (UTC)
 * Can't the length be done automatically, like the 'age' in infoboxes? Peridon (talk) 20:33, 13 November 2012 (UTC)
 * Not really, no, not on a page that would be this long. The software can't handle that number of template transclusions on a single page, and the load time would also be excessive. DrKiernan (talk) 22:32, 13 November 2012 (UTC)


 * Keep Too notable for deletion. - Presidentman talk · contribs Random Picture of the Day (Talkback) 21:08, 14 November 2012 (UTC)
 * Delete per the nomination - little point in duplicating a category and this article adds no value over the category itself. --Biker Biker (talk) 10:13, 17 November 2012 (UTC)
 * Category pages can and should coexist with list pages (WP:CLN). — Richardguk (talk) 11:54, 19 November 2012 (UTC)
 * Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.


 * Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, — Theo polisme  03:52, 18 November 2012 (UTC)


 * Automated comment: This AfD was not correctly transcluded to the log (step 3). I have transcluded it to Articles for deletion/Log/2012 November 18.  Snotbot   t &bull; c &raquo;  08:20, 18 November 2012 (UTC)
 * Keep If there is duplication then the solution is to merge or restructure. If there's a technical problem with templates then use a technical solution such as cite quick.  Deletion is not appropriate as the list is notable per WP:LISTN and so should remain a blue link. Warden (talk) 12:45, 18 November 2012 (UTC)
 * Keep Obvious notable list of a notable set of individuals. The arguements for deletion based on the category already existing fail WP:CLN.  Lugnuts  Dick Laurent is dead 14:27, 18 November 2012 (UTC)
 * No. The argument for deletion or merge is that the list is duplicated. You have misread the rationale. DrKiernan (talk) 14:46, 18 November 2012 (UTC)
 * I think Lugnuts is referring to the comment from Biker Biker. As to duplication: please explain why you think the 2010 list is adequate for readers who want to know only the current MPs (taking account of by-election changes). — Richardguk (talk) 11:54, 19 November 2012 (UTC)
 * There are already lists of current MPs: List of MPs for Welsh constituencies 2010–, List of MPs for English constituencies 2010–, List of MPs for constituencies in Scotland 2010–, and List of MPs for constituencies in Northern Ireland 2010–. These are not lists of MPs elected in 2010: that list is at List of MPs elected in the United Kingdom general election, 2010. These are lists of MPs from 2010 to the present. We do not need another list showing the identical information in a different format. DrKiernan (talk) 13:21, 19 November 2012 (UTC)

Comment: Most of the above comments seem to be arguing at cross purposes. We all agree that the list content is notable and that there is substantial overlap with other lists (i.e. of MPs elected in 2010). If you advocate keeping the new article, please explain above why you believe that the existing lists are inadequate enough to justify maintaining a separate page. If you advocate deletion/merger, please explain above why you believe that the existing lists of 2010 MPs are adequate for readers wanting to know the current MPs (taking account of by-election changes). — Richardguk (talk) 11:59, 19 November 2012 (UTC)
 * I have already done that. The pages in Category:Lists of UK MPs 2010– are for MPs from 2010 to the present, that includes current MPs. Let's say I want to know who is the MP for West Belfast: I go to List of MPs for constituencies in Northern Ireland 2010– and see it is Paul Maskey, elected in 2011. If I want to know who was the MP elected in the general election, I go to List of MPs elected in the United Kingdom general election, 2010 and see that it is Gerry Adams. There is no need for this extra page (although it would be useful as a link to the existing 4 pages). DrKiernan (talk) 13:21, 19 November 2012 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.