Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of out-of-town shopping centres in the United Kingdom (3rd nomination)


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. Nomination withdrawn. (non-admin closure) Ajf773 (talk) 17:41, 16 January 2018 (UTC)

List of out-of-town shopping centres in the United Kingdom
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I fail to understand how a topic about shopping centres existing out-of-town can be notable. No sources provided giving any indication this is a notable topic so appears to be a simple case of WP:NOR and WP:NLIST. This article has survived two AfD's one as part of a bulk nomination and another as procedural keep (due to blocked nominator) Ajf773 (talk) 23:50, 6 January 2018 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Lists-related deletion discussions. Ajf773 (talk) 23:50, 6 January 2018 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Shopping malls-related deletion discussions. Ajf773 (talk) 23:50, 6 January 2018 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of United Kingdom-related deletion discussions. Ajf773 (talk) 23:50, 6 January 2018 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * The distinction between out-of-town and in-town shopping centres is very commonly made. For example just look at the first few books found by this search. 86.17.222.157 (talk) 11:33, 7 January 2018 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks,  Sandstein   18:51, 13 January 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete, no evidence that this is a notable distinction for a list. Ten Pound Hammer • (What did I screw up now?) 03:23, 14 January 2018 (UTC)
 * Keep IDONTUNDERSTANDIT is not a valid reason for deletion.
 * The notion of "out of town shopping" is a serious planning issue in the UK, probably the rest of Europe too. In the US it's just a done deal. Andy Dingley (talk) 14:07, 14 January 2018 (UTC)
 * In all of the articles in the list, the distinction of 'out-of-town' doesn't even get a mention. It's original research. Do we need a list of in-town shopping centres too? Ajf773 (talk) 17:43, 14 January 2018 (UTC)
 * WP is not the arbiter of whether a term is significant or not. Also the claim "'out-of-town' doesn't even get a mention" seems a bit hollow when it's right there in the article name. It is far from WP:OR to see that the rise (and maybe fall) of out-of-town shopping in the UK is an issue taken very seriously for planning, town centre redevelopment, the retail industry and even motorway design, to the point where it's part of the school exam curriculum in geoography.
 * Andy Dingley (talk) 18:30, 14 January 2018 (UTC)
 * You are talking about the concept of out-of-town shopping centres being a notable topic - perhaps there is, write an article about it sometime. I'm talking about the article list itself. There is no clear inclusion criteria for each of the listed articles (as there is no mentioned of being 'out-of-town' in their content) which is why I've flagged this as WP:OR. We could remove the original research but all it would yield would be a bare list. Ajf773 (talk) 19:26, 14 January 2018 (UTC)
 * Your nomination was quite clear, " a topic about shopping centres existing out-of-town " - are you now changing it? Andy Dingley (talk) 20:00, 14 January 2018 (UTC)
 * No. Ajf773 (talk) 21:05, 14 January 2018 (UTC)
 * Andy Dingley (talk) 18:30, 14 January 2018 (UTC)
 * You are talking about the concept of out-of-town shopping centres being a notable topic - perhaps there is, write an article about it sometime. I'm talking about the article list itself. There is no clear inclusion criteria for each of the listed articles (as there is no mentioned of being 'out-of-town' in their content) which is why I've flagged this as WP:OR. We could remove the original research but all it would yield would be a bare list. Ajf773 (talk) 19:26, 14 January 2018 (UTC)
 * Your nomination was quite clear, " a topic about shopping centres existing out-of-town " - are you now changing it? Andy Dingley (talk) 20:00, 14 January 2018 (UTC)
 * No. Ajf773 (talk) 21:05, 14 January 2018 (UTC)
 * Andy Dingley (talk) 18:30, 14 January 2018 (UTC)
 * You are talking about the concept of out-of-town shopping centres being a notable topic - perhaps there is, write an article about it sometime. I'm talking about the article list itself. There is no clear inclusion criteria for each of the listed articles (as there is no mentioned of being 'out-of-town' in their content) which is why I've flagged this as WP:OR. We could remove the original research but all it would yield would be a bare list. Ajf773 (talk) 19:26, 14 January 2018 (UTC)
 * Your nomination was quite clear, " a topic about shopping centres existing out-of-town " - are you now changing it? Andy Dingley (talk) 20:00, 14 January 2018 (UTC)
 * No. Ajf773 (talk) 21:05, 14 January 2018 (UTC)


 * Keep these are mentioned in several books, and it's usually the same shopping centres:; there's a list of "regional shopping centres" or "regional malls" which is a less commonly used phrase but may be more precise (outlet malls such as Freeport Braintree are sometimes called out-of-town shopping centres). Peter James (talk) 18:35, 14 January 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks for these references! XOR&#39;easter (talk) 00:50, 15 January 2018 (UTC)
 * Keep, possibly rename to Out-of-town shopping centres in the United Kingdom, adding more historical/urban planning perspective on the general topic, per the comments above. (E.g., "Out-of-town shopping in the United Kingdom is an issue considered for urban planning, town centre redevelopment, the retail industry and even motorway design. Due to its significance for these issues, it has been included in the school exam curriculum in geography.") XOR&#39;easter (talk) 20:37, 14 January 2018 (UTC)
 * So who's going to do that? The common scenario of keep outcomes seems to be nothing discussed in the AfD ever gets done. Ajf773 (talk) 21:04, 14 January 2018 (UTC)
 * So what have you done to encourage the improvement of articles? It's easy to keep slating things for deletion, but it's also a great way to piss off just those who might be the ones to work on improving them. And this goes double for Hammer. Andy Dingley (talk) 21:30, 14 January 2018 (UTC)
 * WP:NOTCOMPULSORY. Ajf773 (talk) 23:00, 14 January 2018 (UTC)
 * "Focus on improving the encyclopedia itself, rather than demanding more from other Wikipedians."
 * So how about it? Andy Dingley (talk) 00:51, 15 January 2018 (UTC)


 * Keep Important human geography topic, widely studied at schools as part of the National Curriculum. Article seems to be well referenced. ▲RedScrees (talk) 12:50, 16 January 2018 (UTC)
 * Update courtesy of XOR&#39;easter who has salvaged the article from certain fate by properly referencing content I've agreed to withdraw the nomination and rename to Out-of-town shopping centres in the United Kingdom as per suggested. Ajf773 (talk) 17:41, 16 January 2018 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.