Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of people associated with Bletchley Park


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.  

The result was keep. John254 16:46, 6 January 2008 (UTC)

List of people associated with Bletchley Park

 * I just added the title above to separate this AfD from the one above it. This is not my nomination, I have nothing to do with this article, please read how to do an AfD before doing this again, whoever nominated this article, it makes the AfD page incomprehensible when the comments below are under a heading about a TV series. Jackaranga (talk) 14:14, 1 January 2008 (UTC)
 * I just added the title above to separate this AfD from the one above it. This is not my nomination, I have nothing to do with this article, please read how to do an AfD before doing this again, whoever nominated this article, it makes the AfD page incomprehensible when the comments below are under a heading about a TV series. Jackaranga (talk) 14:14, 1 January 2008 (UTC)

Merge in Bletchley Park: In wikipedia there is already an article Bletchley Park. This info can easily go there. Such trivial info canonot deserve for a separate article. As such numerous articles can be created like List of people associated with Tajmahal, List of people associated with New York etc. etc. This info can easily go in the "In popular culture" section of the Bletchley Park article. Otolemur crassicaudatus (talk) 13:48, 1 January 2008 (UTC)
 * This isn't "in popular culture", these are people who worked on an historically important project. If that isn't encyclopedic, I'll eat my hat. "Associated with" does not necessarily open the door to other miscellaneous articles, if that's what you're concerned with. There's no way this could be recast as "List of people from Bletchley Park'', for instance, even if they lived there temporarily. --Dhartung | Talk 22:16, 1 January 2008 (UTC)


 * Keep. This is useful reference information. 1) I'm confused by the suggestion to put this in a "in popular culture" section. In what sense is this information related to popular culture? 2) This information cannot "easily" go into Bletchley Park -- indeed, I split this list out of that article in January 2006 because it was becoming too large to fit there. 3) I would argue that a list is useful in addition to having a category because it can be annotated with extra information. &mdash; Matt Crypto 13:57, 1 January 2008 (UTC)


 * Keep It's unwieldy to try to contain this information in Bletchly Park. I disagree with the "in popular culture" assessment. Many of the people listed are notable both for being involved with the project at Bletchly Park and for subsequent work elsewhere. There exists two categories: Category:People associated with Bletchley Park and Category:Bletchley Park; if it is deemed necessary to "deal" with this article, I'd suggest using the already-existing mechanisms to associate people with the project (which would simply mean adding Category:People associated with Bletchley Park to the main Bletchley Park article). Yng  varr  14:24, 1 January 2008 (UTC)


 * Keep - too long a list to merge into main article, and not non-trivial information. Many of the people at Bletchly Park were instrumental in both the war effort, and the advancement of electronics, encryption/decryption and computing after the war. Ben W Bell   talk  17:24, 1 January 2008 (UTC)


 * Delete. Make into a category, not an article.  Malinaccier (talk) 17:50, 1 January 2008 (UTC)


 * Keep. This list contains useful and interesting information, on an important subject.  Now, in general I like categories more than lists (I find them more useful for navigating, and for all sorts of other reasons), so I am intrigued by Malinaccier's proposal: it seems like something very much worth pondering.  Is there something peculiar about this list that would make it better suited as a list per se, instead of a category?  Turgidson (talk) 20:06, 1 January 2008 (UTC)
 * After looking at the article more carefully (and trying my hand at some small edits), I noted something specific about this list —something that may set it apart from lists that could be better turned into categories: it appears to want to (briefly) indicate the future careers of the Bletchly Park code-breakers (and some of those careers, such as that of J. H. C. Whitehead, were truly outstanding). Is this the intent?  I'm still not quite sure, since this is not done uniformly, and not explained—but perhaps this aspect could be developed, so as to fully support keeping this article as a list?  Turgidson (talk) 21:22, 1 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Yeah, that was the original intent. Having a category is good, and I believe we do already, but I don't think it's sufficient, largely because you can annotate a list with information -- such as what they the people did at Bletchley, and whether (as was very often the case) they did something else notable in their lives. I've always understood the role of lists and categories to be complementary on Wikipedia; you don't necessarily have to have just one or the other, but both can be useful. &mdash; Matt Crypto 23:01, 1 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Oh, yes, the category does exist: Category:People associated with Bletchley Park — I've seen it before, for sure, but memory sometimes fades, thanks for the reminder. And, yes, I'm with you for having both categories and lists (each one has i's strengths, and perhaps, sometimes, its weaknesses), though I still prefer categories when everything else is equal, as in the case of the (alas!) defunct Erdős number categories.  In this case, though, given the real potential for expanding the list with info about subsequent careers of the Bletchley Park people (in a multi-column table, yes, great idea!), I am now convinced this subject merits both a category and a list (something I would not say for every category or list, only for select few). Turgidson (talk) 23:20, 1 January 2008 (UTC)


 * Keep. The number of later-famed people associated with the project is long and encyclopedic. It would be good to source both the major positions held and what they are later known for (maybe a three-column table). --Dhartung | Talk 22:12, 1 January 2008 (UTC)
 * A table's not a bad idea at all; it might be easier to peruse than a bullet point list. &mdash; Matt Crypto 23:01, 1 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep. This list is so long it would be cumbersome to put it into another article, and the fact that so many very notable people were associated with Bletchley Park is in itself notable.  This information is certainly not "trivial".  (And the suggestion that this is "popular culture" material makes me wonder if the person who suggested that has any idea what this is about.) Michael Hardy (talk) 03:23, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep Notable subject; objective criterion for inclusion; not trivia or "popular culture"; list is long enough to require its own article. Gandalf61 (talk) 10:29, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep, for reasons already given by others, and suggest that nominator should read WP:LIST and WP:CLS before nominating any more lists for deletion. --Paularblaster (talk) 21:41, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep. Bletchley Park was a seminal event in the history of 20th century technology, at the level of the Manhattan Project, (q.v. Category:Manhattan Project people). This list is exceptionally valuable resource.--agr (talk) 03:27, 6 January 2008 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.