Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of songs about or referencing Elvis Presley (2nd nomination)


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was no consensus. Consensus is clearly against deletion (not one commenter supported the nominator on that argument), and so may be interpreted as a "keep" result in that sense, but editors are divided beyond that. Please continue to discuss through normal channels whether to keep, merge the content, or just redirect. See WP:ATD. postdlf (talk) 15:09, 17 October 2016 (UTC)

List of songs about or referencing Elvis Presley
AfDs for this article: 
 * – ( View AfD View log  Stats )

The page is nothing but listcruft that lacks any real assertion of significance. Mentioning someone in a song isn't in itself a really noteworthy trait anyway. Since this is not a place for excessive listings per WP:What Wikipedia is not, it's best to just delete. Snuggums (talk / edits) 21:04, 29 September 2016 (UTC)


 * Actually, this list does prove something - that Presley's influence over music is so profoundly vast that artists of all different genres, from country to hip hop to rock to indie pop, have referenced him in numerous times in their music, and that seventy years after his commercial peak, he is still a huge part of Western culture. P.S. I promise that if this list is left alone that I will add numerous refernces to it! User:MagicatthemovieS 21:04, 29 September 2016 (UTC)
 * There is already Cultural impact of Elvis Presley which discusses that. Anything on his influence over music is best placed either there or in his main bio. Snuggums (talk / edits) 03:17, 30 September 2016 (UTC)
 * This article was nominated for deletion before and it was decided that it should be left alone. Shouldn't we defer to that decision? User:MagicatthemovieS 21:04, 29 September 2016 (UTC)
 * No. First of all, that ended in "no consensus" rather than an outright "keep", though that wouldn't prevent future AFD nominations regardless. Secondly, just because something was kept before doesn't necessarily mean it should still be kept. Things can change over time, and that discussion was from 2008. Article standards have substantially changed since then. Snuggums (<b style="color:#454545">talk</b> / <b style="color:#454545">edits</b>) 04:26, 30 September 2016 (UTC)


 * Redirect to Cultural impact of Elvis Presley Also keep the history and link to it on the talk page so if someone wants to recreate this list on a more appropriate website they can. There's also a list of "Cultural depictions of Elvis Presley" which was nominated for deletion in 2007 and closed as no consensus that should also be redirected. BigGuy88 (talk) 13:33, 30 September 2016 (UTC)
 * This list is kind of like articles like Cultural depictions of Cleopatra or The Devil in popular culture or any __ in popular culture article only more focused. I fail too see why it needs to be deleted while the aforementioned articles have not been.
 * That's irrelevant per WP:OTHERSTUFF, which states you cannot make a convincing argument based solely on whether other articles do or do not exist. <b style="color:#454545">Snuggums</b> (<b style="color:#454545">talk</b> / <b style="color:#454545">edits</b>) 00:29, 1 October 2016 (UTC)
 * <small class="delsort-notice">Note: This debate has been included in the list of Lists-related deletion discussions. Coolabahapple (talk) 14:27, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
 * <small class="delsort-notice">Note: This debate has been included in the list of Albums and songs-related deletion discussions. Coolabahapple (talk) 14:27, 4 October 2016 (UTC)

<div class="xfd_relist" style="border-top: 1px solid #AAA; border-bottom: 1px solid #AAA; padding: 0px 25px;"> Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, <b style="color:#FFCC33">Yellow</b> <b style="color:brown">Dingo</b>&#160;<b style="color:BLUE">(talk)</b> 00:13, 7 October 2016 (UTC)
 * Keep "I don't like it" but this kind of list is standard practice on WP.Thoughtmonkey (talk) 12:48, 7 October 2016 (UTC)
 * How exactly is this "standard practice"? I can't really think of any similar pages like it. <b style="color:#454545">Snuggums</b> (<b style="color:#454545">talk</b> / <b style="color:#454545">edits</b>) 14:01, 7 October 2016 (UTC)
 * How about "List of songs about...", for instance List of songs about the environment. Thoughtmonkey (talk) 02:39, 8 October 2016 (UTC)
 * Never saw that before. In any case, whether other things exist (or don't exist) is a moot point per WP:OTHERSTUFF. <b style="color:#454545">Snuggums</b> (<b style="color:#454545">talk</b> / <b style="color:#454545">edits</b>) 04:18, 8 October 2016 (UTC)
 * I wish that the "other stuff exists" policy had some effect on AfD discussions, but I have never seen it to.Thoughtmonkey (talk) 18:48, 8 October 2016 (UTC)
 * To make my view more clear: I would like to see a lot less popular culture, original research lists. However I do watch the AfD's and it is very rare when one gets deleted.  Obviously lots of people like them and others are not offended, and WP policy is not taken that literally or seriously as, in fact, I would like. Deleting this one would either be an unfair exception or else a start of a long and difficult campaign to get rid of the rest.  Take your pick.  Sounds like a big waste of time to me. Not my job to change people's attitudes.Thoughtmonkey (talk) 18:55, 8 October 2016 (UTC)
 * Other stuff existing (or not existing) is NOT a valid reason in itself for maintaining this, in case that point wasn't already clear. Just because other pages are mistakenly kept doesn't mean this one should be. It also doesn't make sense to vote "keep" on something you feel should be deleted. <b style="color:#454545">Snuggums</b> (<b style="color:#454545">talk</b> / <b style="color:#454545">edits</b>) 22:58, 8 October 2016 (UTC)


 * Keep. Songs about Presley are discussed by several sources, including George Plasketes' Images of Elvis Presley in American Culture, 1977-1997: The Mystery Terrain. --Michig (talk) 18:19, 7 October 2016 (UTC)
 * That's not the point; just because something is discussed doesn't automatically mean it is noteworthy. Referencing a person within songs isn't exactly in itself a significant trait. <b style="color:#454545">Snuggums</b> (<b style="color:#454545">talk</b> / <b style="color:#454545">edits</b>) 19:23, 7 October 2016 (UTC)
 * Songs referencing Elvis Presley is a bit tenuous for a list, but there are a significant number about Elvis Presley, which is, in your terms, a significant trait. I would note that a lot of the songs listed here as being 'about' Presley really are not, but if you brush away the chaff there's enough there for a decent list. --Michig (talk) 17:49, 10 October 2016 (UTC)
 * On the contrary, I never said or even suggested that being about Elvis was significant. <b style="color:#454545">Snuggums</b> (<b style="color:#454545">talk</b> / <b style="color:#454545">edits</b>) 18:06, 10 October 2016 (UTC)
 * I didn't say you did. I just stated my opinion that it is significant. --Michig (talk) 18:13, 10 October 2016 (UTC)


 * Redirect to Cultural impact of Elvis Presley. Right now the list looks like a link farm for the performers of the songs rather than being about the songs themselves. The article is largely WP:OR, i.e. who determines whether the song is "About" Presley vs being "Substantive reference" vs "Nominal reference"? Most of the content does not have citations so it's also the case of WP:V not being met. With a redirect, anything useful could be pulled from the article history.


 * If the article is kept, the list should be culled to only those songs that have articles themselves. Otherwise, this is an indiscriminate collection of information and is not suitable for inclusion. The list would also need to be checked for OR, for example, the White_Privilege_II article mentions Presley exactly once. Overall, I think a redirect would be preferable as this looks to be more hassle than it's worth. K.e.coffman (talk) 01:49, 9 October 2016 (UTC)
 * Good luck with that. The problem is that many more people will care deeply about their favorite song than about some WP policy. Once again: "I don't like it." Thoughtmonkey (talk) 17:13, 10 October 2016 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.