Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of video game soundtracks released on vinyl (2nd nomination)


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. WP:LISTN is the applicable criterion here, and substantive evidence has been provided that this topics meets the criterion. Those arguing to keep are quite correct in stating that NLIST does not require every list entry to be discussed in reliable sources, only the group as a group. Vanamonde (Talk) 17:02, 14 December 2022 (UTC)

List of video game soundtracks released on vinyl
AfDs for this article:


 * – ( View AfD View log | edits since nomination)

I understand that there may be information about the rise and popularity of issuing video game soundtracks on vinyl (as discussed in the History section), but that information can be incorporated into Video game music. Aside from that, there is not really a need for a list to include albums with such a trivial intersection. Of course, you can always claim "coverage" in the form of routine announcements (e.g., "X Game's Soundtrack Releases on Digital and Vinyl"), but that would set an unneeded precedent. Otherwise you could have articles such as "List of vinyl reissues" or "List of movie soundtracks released on vinyl" which both could have just as many "reliable" sources. The last nomination had fairly poor keep rationales (such as "vinyl releases are interesting these days"), so I am renominating. Why? I Ask (talk) 11:57, 7 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Albums and songs, Music, Video games,  and Lists. Why? I Ask (talk) 11:57, 7 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Comment: Pinging contributors from the first discussion: . IceWelder  &#91; &#9993; &#93; 12:04, 7 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Keep - I still find myself persuaded by Thibbs in the first discussion, it's a reliably sourced list. Sergecross73   msg me  12:17, 7 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Being verifiable does not mean there's a reason to make a list. It's run-of-the-mill release announcements. Why? I Ask (talk) 12:27, 7 December 2022 (UTC)
 * No, as Thibbs pointed out, there's are reliable sources that discuss the concept in general as well. Reliable sources that point out the role of video games soundtrack releases in the late 2010's larger upswing of the medium. And not just once - there's detailed coverage of it. And each individual entry is reliably sourced too. Sergecross73   msg me  12:37, 7 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Yes, and I directly mentioned that the information about vinyl and video game music is fine. It's the actual listing of them that's the issue. Discussing a notable practice in an industry is fine, but not listing albums simply because they happen to be in a certain medium. I can find articles about the transition to digital music. A similar list of albums only released digitally would also be silly to have. Why? I Ask (talk) 12:45, 7 December 2022 (UTC)
 * We've got sources for ever item, and sources documenting the overall concept. Not sure what else you want here. Sergecross73   msg me  13:01, 7 December 2022 (UTC)


 * Keep: Given the amount of coverage there is for every entry on the list (too much on a few if you ask me but that's another matter) and how reliable it all appears to be, I think notability overrides this concern about necessity here. The publications care a lot about reporting on these vinyl releases and it's hard to call that indiscriminate. Could use some cleanup and especially some MOS:MAJORWORK attention but otherwise I don't see anything wrong here. QuietHere (talk) 13:08, 7 December 2022 (UTC)


 * Delete This article appears to fail WP:INDISCRIMINATE. The fact that vinyl music was partially helped by VGM soundtrack sales has nothing to do with keeping a list of them. It fails the "will only fans care" test, as the info is literally only relevant to fans of video game music and vinyl records. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 14:46, 7 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Delete: I agree that video game albums released on vinyl is a trivial intersection. This may work better as a category, but it is not really a defining characteristic either. I do not think "lots of reliable sources" is a good argument in this case to justify notability, when items on the list are mostly supported by run-of-the-mill routine announcements. RS can report on itmes we deem unimportant and trivial as well. Information about vinyl and video game music can be kept, but I do not see the necessity of keeping the list. OceanHok (talk) 14:58, 7 December 2022 (UTC)


 * Keep Meets WP:LISTN: the subject "has been discussed as a group or set by independent reliable sources". Sojourner in the earth (talk) 23:44, 7 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Comment: While WP:LISTN is fairly vague, I don't believe that the criteria of has been discussed as a group or set has been met. There are sources discussing the concept and practice, and there are release announcements. I'm not seeing sources that actually attempt to tabulate a list of video game soundtracks on vinyl. Why? I Ask (talk) 01:53, 8 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Keep the list is focussed and has focussed criteria for inclusion - see WP:LSC Lightburst (talk) 02:54, 8 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Keep Meets WP:LISTN - concept has been discussed as a group in secondary sources. ResonantDistortion 10:41, 8 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Delete. It's an indiscriminate list, type x of music release on type x of physical media. soetermans . ↑↑↓↓←→←→ B A TALK 10:54, 8 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Keep per arguments in the first AFD, and per . The article cites a lot of sources, and not all of them meet the criteria of discussing the concept as a group or set.  Note that discussing them as a group or set does not necessitate the source to be a comprehensive list.  I'm looking at sources that discuss the concept of videogame soundtracks being released on vinyl along side a variety of examples of the phenomenon.  There are sources in the article that limit themselves to discussing a specific release, which is reliable sourcing for the inclusion of that album on the list but does not contribute to the WP:LISTN criteria, and there are sources in the article that discuss the broader concept more generally. To make it easier on others; some of the specific sources currently cited in the article that I feel meet the criteria of discussing the concept as a group or set include (but are not limited to) the following:
 * ~  ONUnicorn (Talk&#124;Contribs) problem solving 18:16, 9 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Nope, those sources really don't. Obviously, an article about video game soundtracks on vinyl is going to have examples, but that does mean they have been discussed as a whole set. Why? I Ask (talk) 20:01, 9 December 2022 (UTC)
 * The coverage doesn't need to be a whole collective set though. We've got all sorts of video game library lists like List of PlayStation 4 games even though there's no other reliable source on the planet that lists all of the 1000s of released games. Why? Because there's no shortage of sources discussing its library in a general sense. Same applies here. Sergecross73   msg me  20:09, 9 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Not really comparable; the are tons of lists of PlayStation 4 games, not just articles that mention examples of games. And in this case, it would be more similar to "List of digital PlayStation 4 games", divided by medium. If it was just a "List of video game soundtracks" that just had a column listing the available mediums, that would be better. A lede discussing the use of each medium would be better too. Why? I Ask (talk) 20:26, 9 December 2022 (UTC)
 * From WP:NLIST "The entirety of the list does not need to be documented in sources for notability, only that the grouping or set in general has been." So a source that says (for example): "one of the first instances of game music on vinyl was in 1978 with Yellow Magic Orchestra’s self-titled record. It contained remixes from Circus and Space Invaders and paved the way for other releases through the late 1970s and early 1980s that included lots of Pac-Man, Asteroids, Yars’ Revenge, Missile Command, and others. These even got their own drama albums complete with read-along books that told brief stories from these games. Jump forward to 1983 and you have Do the Donkey Kong and Donkey Kong proper. Through the mid-1980s, Namco came on board with Xevious followed by their compilation album, Namco Video Game Graffiti which featured Dig Dug, Sky Kid, New Rally-X!, Mappy, and more." is discussing videogame soundtracks on vinyl as a group or a set.  It's not a comprehensive list - our list doesn't copy and paste that article, but it is still discussing them as a group or set. ~  ONUnicorn (Talk&#124;Contribs) problem solving 05:22, 10 December 2022 (UTC)
 * That's not discussing them as a group. It's simply name-dropping examples. And also from WP:NLIST: there is no present consensus for how to assess the notability of more complex and cross-categorization lists (such as "Lists of X of Y") which is what this is. Citing that as a be all end all is not helpful. For such a cross-categorization of "X of Y", there needs to be further proof that a list is justified. Why? I Ask (talk) 15:49, 10 December 2022 (UTC)
 * @Then what would you look for in determining if something discusses something as a group or a set? How are you interpreting that criteria? ~  ONUnicorn (Talk&#124;Contribs) problem solving 16:59, 12 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Not really comparable; the are tons of lists of PlayStation 4 games, not just articles that mention examples of games. And in this case, it would be more similar to "List of digital PlayStation 4 games", divided by medium. If it was just a "List of video game soundtracks" that just had a column listing the available mediums, that would be better. A lede discussing the use of each medium would be better too. Why? I Ask (talk) 20:26, 9 December 2022 (UTC)
 * From WP:NLIST "The entirety of the list does not need to be documented in sources for notability, only that the grouping or set in general has been." So a source that says (for example): "one of the first instances of game music on vinyl was in 1978 with Yellow Magic Orchestra’s self-titled record. It contained remixes from Circus and Space Invaders and paved the way for other releases through the late 1970s and early 1980s that included lots of Pac-Man, Asteroids, Yars’ Revenge, Missile Command, and others. These even got their own drama albums complete with read-along books that told brief stories from these games. Jump forward to 1983 and you have Do the Donkey Kong and Donkey Kong proper. Through the mid-1980s, Namco came on board with Xevious followed by their compilation album, Namco Video Game Graffiti which featured Dig Dug, Sky Kid, New Rally-X!, Mappy, and more." is discussing videogame soundtracks on vinyl as a group or a set.  It's not a comprehensive list - our list doesn't copy and paste that article, but it is still discussing them as a group or set. ~  ONUnicorn (Talk&#124;Contribs) problem solving 05:22, 10 December 2022 (UTC)
 * That's not discussing them as a group. It's simply name-dropping examples. And also from WP:NLIST: there is no present consensus for how to assess the notability of more complex and cross-categorization lists (such as "Lists of X of Y") which is what this is. Citing that as a be all end all is not helpful. For such a cross-categorization of "X of Y", there needs to be further proof that a list is justified. Why? I Ask (talk) 15:49, 10 December 2022 (UTC)
 * @Then what would you look for in determining if something discusses something as a group or a set? How are you interpreting that criteria? ~  ONUnicorn (Talk&#124;Contribs) problem solving 16:59, 12 December 2022 (UTC)


 * Comment: I would propose merging this article and List of video game soundtracks on music streaming platforms and doing what I discussed above where there is simply a master list of video game soundtracks (with the medium listed, obviously) with a lede that can discuss the use of CDs, vinyl, and digital, or whatever else. Why? I Ask (talk) 20:32, 9 December 2022 (UTC)
 * I don't prefer this option, but I do prefer it as a 2nd choice over deletion. Sergecross73   msg me  20:56, 9 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Keep - Article meets WP:NLIST because sources discuss it as a group, and I agree that comments by Thibbs in the previous AfD are persuasive in this regard. I don't find the WP:OSE rationales for deletion particularly compelling reasons for deletion; notability guidelines should not be discounted because of the perceived flaws of hypothetical articles that don't exist; this AfD is about this article and it must be judged on its own merits, not on the merits of movie articles that don't exist. - Aoidh (talk) 15:22, 10 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Keep - Per above arguments. MaxnaCarta (talk) 06:08, 14 December 2022 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.