Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Loona Luxx


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   keep. Mark Arsten (talk) 01:58, 13 September 2013 (UTC)

Loona Luxx

 * – ( View AfD View log  Stats )

Fails WP:PORNBIO for the following reasons. 4 of her nominations for awards are for scenes. The Hot D'or is not a "well-known and significant industry award". That leaves 2 nominations for the AVN Awards which still means she has not  "been nominated for such an award several times". A quick Internet search reveals nothing that suggests she passes WP:GNG. Finnegas (talk) 17:32, 6 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been added to the WikiProject Pornography list of deletions. • Gene93k (talk) 18:45, 6 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of France-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 18:45, 6 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Actors and filmmakers-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 18:46, 6 September 2013 (UTC)


 * Automated comment: This AfD was not correctly transcluded to the log (step 3). I have transcluded it to Articles for deletion/Log/2013 September 6.  — cyberbot I  Notify Online 18:46, 6 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Keep - "The Hot d'Or is not a 'well-known and significant industry award'." Yes, it is. In fact, "it has been described as the porn equivalent of the Palme d'Or or the Academy Awards" and "the analogous American honor is the AVN Award." The subject here has been nominated for "a well-known and significant industry award" several times and therefore meets PORNBIO. BTW, there's no requirement that I'm aware of that "significant" nominations be from different years or from different sets of award ceremonies. Guy1890 (talk) 19:07, 6 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Keep, if there is an European award that is both well-known and significant, it is the Hot D'Or. It is the European equivalent of AVN Award and received tons of mainstream coverage in newspapers, books and magazines, more than many mainstream festivals. Being nominated for both the most important European award and the most important USA award is a clear sign of notability in this field. Also, I'm not sure she fails GNG, as there are several news articles (mainly from East Europe) about her in Google News archives, , , , . Cavarrone 19:55, 6 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Keep. Finnegas, I'm not exactly sure what you consider a significant industry award (this isn't the first time you've used that rationale), but AVN, XBIZ and XRCO aren't the only porn awards that are notable (there's also Urban X, GayVN, the aforementioned Hot d'Or, and the list goes on). Speaking of AVN, though, the Best Tease Performance and the Female Foreign Performer of the Year noms would also suffice even if the Hot d'Or noms weren't there; and two awards are several (several means more than one; check merriam-webster.com).  Erpert  WHAT DO YOU WANT??? 08:41, 7 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Erpert, the list cannot go on,only a certain number of awards can be "well-known and significant industry award". At AFD there is a tendency for editors to claim every award is sufficient. I must admit as for as I was concerned, several = a significant number = many = numerous. IE more than two. Finnegas (talk) 18:16, 7 September 2013 (UTC)
 * "only a certain number of awards can be 'well-known and significant industry award'." No one is claiming here that every award meets the PORNBIO standard. "I must admit as for as I was concerned, several = a significant number = many = numerous. IE more than two." That standard flies in the face of recent & established precedent here at AfD, and the above common definition of "several". Guy1890 (talk) 23:37, 7 September 2013 (UTC)


 * Delete. While the original Hot D'Or was generally significant, the award was discontinued in 2001. All of the cited sources supporting its notability refer to that original award, and typically rely substantially on the award's connections to the Cannes Film Festival. Luxx did not receive that award, but an ersatz one-off revival nearly a decade after the "real" award had been discontinued, with no connection to Cannes, a more bloated set of award categories, and nowhere near the recognition or significance. The GNews citations contain no substantial coverage of Luxx, but typically report only her appearance at various trade shows without providing any other information concerning her. And the "Best Tease Performance" award is a scene-related award, per previous discussions. This may be a closer call than some discussions, but the PORNBIO claims amount to no more than a narrow technical pass, clearly outweighed by thge subject's failure to pass the GNG by a wide margin, as evidenced by the complete lack of well-sourced biographical content and the absence of substantive commentary on the subject's work. Hullaballoo Wolfowitz (talk) 13:35, 7 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Just because an award ceremony has been discontinued doesn't mean it is no longer notable (see WP:NOTTEMPORARY). And as for Best Tease Performance being a scene-related award, I've seen some users suggest that, but to my knowledge, an actual consensus about that has yet to be met.  Erpert  WHAT DO YOU WANT??? 17:57, 7 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Just because an otherwise non-notable award takes its name from a defunct notable award does not mean it WP:INHERITs the defunct award's notability; you're replying to a strawman argument I did not make. I believe it was User:Morbidthoughts who made the strongest case that the "tease" award is scene-related (if I've misremembered, I expect we'll hear from him), and he's familiar with the award criteria; I don't see any instances of anyone making a reasonable case otherwise. It is not the case that award categories are presumed to meet the "well-known/significant standard", in any event, and downlevel categories are routinely rejected. Hullaballoo Wolfowitz (talk) 18:41, 7 September 2013 (UTC)
 * 2009 Hot d'Or is not "an otherwise non-notable award (which) takes its name from a defunct notable award", it is the same exact award, still organized by Hot Vidéo (as you can read in both the related articles about the award and the magazine), still notable and significant as before (as demonstrated by the many sources which covered it, I posted some below, I can provide more). All the sources covering the 2009 edition support the fact that it is the same award and not a different award with the same name. Cavarrone 18:56, 7 September 2013 (UTC)
 * "While the original Hot D'Or was generally significant, the award was discontinued in 2001." No, it wasn't, and, even if it had been, notability does not degrade over time. "Luxx did not receive that award" She was nominated for that exact same award, and that has already been well-established in the article in question here. "the PORNBIO claims amount to no more than a narrow technical pass"...which means that article should be kept, period. "as evidenced by the complete lack of well-sourced biographical content" Once again, that's an opinion, not a fact. "It is not the case that award categories are presumed to meet the 'well-known/significant standard', in any event, and downlevel categories are routinely rejected." Being nominated for a "Performer Of The Year" award is obviously a major award. Guy1890 (talk) 23:37, 7 September 2013 (UTC)
 * "While the original Hot D'Or was generally significant, the award was discontinued in 2001. All of the cited sources supporting its notability refer to that original award, and typically rely substantially on the award's connections to the Cannes Film Festival." Venice Film Festival was not held between 1940 and 1945, but it does not mean it lost its importance and significance. The 2009 edition is still the "original award", and it still received large mainstream attention by very reliable sources, eg Le Parisien, Huffington Post , Libération , Premiere , Metro just to mention a few... Cavarrone  18:34, 7 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Keep Passes WP:PORNBIO with the AVN Female Foreign Performer Of The Year and the Hot d'Or Best French Female Performer awards which are both "well-known and significant industry awards". Rebecca1990 (talk) 23:34, 12 September 2013 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.